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GN Podcast #453

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Former THQ president says Nintendo is irrelevant in the console space, then calls them a 'worldwide treasure'

Coming from former THQ president, Jason Rubin...

"Nintendo is irrelevant as a hardware manufacturer in the console business."

Rubin went on to say that Nintendo is a "worldwide treasure," then stated that "it is a crime that we do not play those games on the systems that we have." The full interview has been posted after the jump.



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35 total comments (View all)
User avatar
02 Dec 2013 03:02

Furious Francis wrote:And the last time I checked, the Xbox 360 isn't relevant in Japan. And I doubt the Xbox One will be either. So you're telling me the only relevant console in Japan will be the PS4? LOL that's a bunch of bullSh*t


The only relevant console in Japan (at the moment) is the 3DS.
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02 Dec 2013 03:06

The problem are REAllY that too many of the presidents of third party companies think like this guy and then choose to not support Nintendo hardware in any meaningful way, maybe except for Ubisoft to some degree. Thereby making the prophecy self-fulfilling.
Just think about it, its the lack of third party support that make Nintendo consoles seem irrelevant to some, nothing else.
User avatar
02 Dec 2013 03:10

ronnande wrote:The problem are REAllY that too many of the presidents of third party companies think like this guy and then choose to not support Nintendo hardware in any meaningful way, maybe except for Ubisoft to some degree. Thereby making the prophecy self-fulfilling.
Just think about it, its the lack of third party support that make Nintendo consoles seem irrelevant to some, nothing else.

They could also stand to make more Nintendo-like games as well... something that doesn't revolve around brocore gameplay ideals...

Seriously, one of the biggest reasons I ignore third party games is because they just don't appeal to me like Nintendo games do...
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02 Dec 2013 03:11

it would just be some very short term profit and that's it. The problem is that the whole shareholders systems is geared towards that. A very stupid decision , and we have actual proof with sega classic .
User avatar
02 Dec 2013 03:21

@InvalidRobot See I have a problem with saying Nintendo systems are a "joke" compared to the other consoles AND a PC. If anything the hardware compliments a PC and most all PC fans I know enjoy Nintendo platforms and games. If anything it makes PS and X box irrelevant. And to me it makes no sense that they should go third party when the other consoles essentially make really unbalanced machines that have poor ventilation and a pretty high failure rate compared to other electronics.

That said I think ALL consoles will end as soon as tech becomes smaller. The reason being that diminishing returns on graphical capability will eventually make handheld gaming devices just as powerful if not more so than consoles. Or at the very least the differences will be so hard to tell that it would not matter. When that happens Nintendo is in a prime spot because their handheld have always been gold and nothing replaces it for any meaningful gaming experience. And mobile games definitely don't cut it.
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02 Dec 2013 03:23

So irrelevant that everyone else is copying them based on their success and catchiness. Gee.
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02 Dec 2013 03:28

Furious Francis wrote:
Orian wrote:It's true if you think about it. They get no attention from the hardcore audience, and the casual audience has moved on to Angry Birds and things like that. Nintendo shot itself in the foot with how they treated the Wii from 2009 on and their refusal to evolve or market their brand in the current age of graphic crazy consumers and phone games. Nintendo has its audience, of course, but they've lost their footing on a global level outside of the portable market. I'm sure they'll find it again, but right now they are verging on losing relevance.


- Nothing you said proves what you say. They get no attention from the Hardcore crowd? Says who? The online internet forums? Nintendo shot themselves in the foot by how they treated the Wii from 2009? Last time I checked, DKC, Kirby, SMG 2, Xenoblade, The Last Story, Zelda Skyward Sword. Punch Out, Metroid Prime Trilogy, Metroid Other M, and so many other great games came out in 2009 or later.

And the last time I checked, the Xbox 360 isn't relevant in Japan. And I doubt the Xbox One will be either. So you're telling me the only relevant console in Japan will be the PS4? LOL that's a bunch of bullSh*t


Sales say they don't get attention from the hardcore crowd, the Wii U has failed to gain traction and it took chopping off a third of the price and a deluge of games to get the 3DS to sell. As for your game defense, last I checked Kirby failed to meet expectations, Xenoblade was a niche title that Nintendo let Gamestop sell exclusively, thus limiting its already limited potential sales. Metroid Prime Trilogy was a single run port collection, Other M was awful, and The Last Story was a clear niche title that failed to breach the mass market. Hell, even Skyward Sword sold half what Twilight Princess sold and people were frothing at the mouth for a new Zelda by the time it released.

And yes, the PS4 will be the only truly relevant console in Japan. Would you like to know why? The Wii U sells a few thousand a week there, even Mario 3d World failed to boost sales. Japan is an increasingly handheld driven country, consoles themselves are growing increasingly irrelevant there.

Before you call someone out on their alleged bull, pull that fanboy stick out of your ass.
User avatar
02 Dec 2013 04:56

MoldyClay wrote:That is some hardcore headline baiting, RMC.

He calls them irrelevant for HARDWARE and goes on to say their SOFTWARE is what's so amazing/worth keeping around.

It's not entirely inaccurate, as much as we don't want to admit. But I'll still buy their consoles first to do my part in keeping them vaguely relevant in hardware.

I took "console" to mean hardware.

And that guy's a jerk. :P
User avatar
02 Dec 2013 05:33

Coming from the least relevant person in gaming and the least relevant company in gaming, this is rich. At least Nintendo didn't drive themselves out of business like THQ.
User avatar
02 Dec 2013 05:46

MoldyClay wrote:That is some hardcore headline baiting, RMC.

He calls them irrelevant for HARDWARE and goes on to say their SOFTWARE is what's so amazing/worth keeping around.

It's not entirely inaccurate, as much as we don't want to admit. But I'll still buy their consoles first to do my part in keeping them vaguely relevant in hardware.


3ds is there to say THQ are wrong
ds is there to say THQ wrong
wii is there to say THQ wrong...

cmon guys numbers are numbers these hardware sold more than their competitors
just wait for the wiiu as we wait for the 3ds
the so called "nextgen" is there showing a very short leg...the "nextgen is already a fad, consumers (i mean casual non fanboys) will not buy a simply upgrade of ps3...
we only received pr marketing numbers "1 million" but no official and documented data, we received pr marketing from gamestop about sold out for preorders but still i can find ps4 in gamestops to buy, should i think that some preordes have been canceled?or never existed?;)
User avatar
02 Dec 2013 06:04

Orian wrote:It's true if you think about it. They get no attention from the hardcore audience, and the casual audience has moved on to Angry Birds and things like that. Nintendo shot itself in the foot with how they treated the Wii from 2009 on and their refusal to evolve or market their brand in the current age of graphic crazy consumers and phone games. Nintendo has its audience, of course, but they've lost their footing on a global level outside of the portable market. I'm sure they'll find it again, but right now they are verging on losing relevance.


if "relevance" is about games like gta or cod or battlefield or fifa or nba im very happy so...
I have a pc to play these games...
and to be true i play games like ArmA or Assetto Corsa on my pc
so not buying these games in any case...
I want only a game from ps3 Ni No Kuni, and i hope wiiu will receive a remake for gamepad or a sequel because is a masterpiece of last generation. No matter it sold poorly, that because casual gamers cannot appreciate these games...
I desire no game from x360.
pc-->fps , racing, rts,indie, emulators
3ds---> portable games
Wiiu--->wii and wiiu games,indie,

when Steam machines will be avaiable i will abadon also microsoft totally

I will miss some ps4 exclusives I know , but my brother is a sonian so he complete once he get a ps4 for cheap(he only buys sony consoles when they get under 200$)...
microsoft is irrilevant nodays
only used for excel and visual studio
i hope they fail soon...it would be a better world!!(like apple and oracle on other other hand)
User avatar
02 Dec 2013 06:46

Maybe Nintendo are slowly becoming irrelevant in the hardware market, but Nintendo software without Nintendo hardware would also be irrelevant.

Like it or not, Nintendo software heavily relies on Nintendo hardware, you can't have one without the other. The state of sega is proof enough, they haven't managed to make a single good game that belongs to one of their classic franchises since they stopped making hardware.

It's not a crime that you can't play Nintendo games on other consoles, it's a crime that you want to play Nintendo games but you don't want to buy their hardware to do so.
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02 Dec 2013 08:11

MoldyClay wrote:That is some hardcore headline baiting, RMC.

He calls them irrelevant for HARDWARE and goes on to say their SOFTWARE is what's so amazing/worth keeping around.

It's not entirely inaccurate, as much as we don't want to admit. But I'll still buy their consoles first to do my part in keeping them vaguely relevant in hardware.


It's even more insulting, they want Nintendo to be chaps of Sony and Microsoft and making their games for their platforms.

I firmly believe that Nintendo, without an hardware market, would not make games anymore.

PS: Go check VGChartz and see what console sold more than the PS4 in the week of the 23rd of November.
User avatar
02 Dec 2013 09:30

Do I detect a hint of jealousy?
User avatar
02 Dec 2013 10:58

Looking at it from 3rd party developers, Nintendo has been irrelevant for quite a while.

It's shame that my initial impulse of interest and exitement, when they announced the WiiU, almost inmediately went away with the tought of the terrible 3rd party support Nintendo's last three home consoles have had.

As a chilhood Nintendo fan, it would be ideal for me to own a console with all of Nintendo's franchises plus the same 3rd party support that Sony and Microsoft have... But as it stands, and like Rubin says, right now the opposite would seems like a more fitting solution.
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02 Dec 2013 11:22

Kroisos wrote:Which entitlement do I address first? The one that says 3rd party developers are entitled to machines that meet their desires, even though they didn't invest one cent into R and D, or the one that says gamers are entitled to games on the system of their desire? Either way, they seem to be saying that Nintendo ought to see to the profitability of every company but itself.


Pretty much. The first point in particular really stands out, mostly because it's repeatedly been shown that third parties, despite and crying for more power, then proceed to waste the potential of that power by not DOING anything with it. Why give them all that power if they're not going to use it properly? I would say a large chunk of this comes from the devs who are whining about power tend to be Westerns ones, and what do they have in common? They were typically PC-centric and thus are used to constant power upgrades unlike consoles where they actually have to use their brains. Limitations scare them because limitations mean that they can't be lazy anymore.

Furthermore, anyone else notice that all the recent people talking crap about Nintendo have something in common? They're all washed-up Western devs who haven't done anything meaningful in years. First we had Jaffe, whose last game was a mediocre, quickly forgotten sequel to Twisted Metal, and whose last MEANINGFUL contribution to gaming was nearly a DECADE AGO. And now we have Rubin who, after leaving Naughty Dog around five years ago, then proceeded to be THQ's final president and is now running a nobody mobile game studio. Why exactly do people keep trying to act like the opinions of these clowns is somehow meaningful? This is just sad
User avatar
02 Dec 2013 11:38

There's an awful lot of ad hominem reasoning going on here.

Unfortunately he's right.
User avatar
02 Dec 2013 11:54

Nintendo does things its own way.

The problem is that most companies don't understand it -- thus they want it to change to something they "get." Basically, they want PC or PC like machines.
The best description that I have seen of Nintendo is by Kyle Bossman who describes Nintendo as a dopey elephant -- but one that is capable of genius when it wants to do so.

The stock price and short-term gain emphasis has caused the market to be looked at in a way that is not healthy for the industry.

Personally, I am enjoying my WiiU more than I typically have enjoyed Naughty Dog or THQ games. So I am not worried. And who is irrelevant?
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02 Dec 2013 12:07

Mike_Intellivision wrote:Nintendo does things its own way.

The problem is that most companies don't understand it -- thus they want it to change to something they "get." Basically, they want PC or PC like machines.
The best description that I have seen of Nintendo is by Kyle Bossman who describes Nintendo as a dopey elephant -- but one that is capable of genius when it wants to do so.

The stock price and short-term gain emphasis has caused the market to be looked at in a way that is not healthy for the industry.

Personally, I am enjoying my WiiU more than I typically have enjoyed Naughty Dog or THQ games. So I am not worried. And who is irrelevant?


I wouldn't call the elephant dopey, more just patient and calm. All other companies subscribe to this ADD-riddled line of thinking that can't see beyond one quarter and they're mad that Nintendo refuses to do the same, thus screwing the narrative that their way is the "right" way. It's like watching a bigot refusing to admit that other cultures exist.
User avatar
02 Dec 2013 12:11

Well, I think maybe he's irrelevant. :lol:

Seriously, though. I can not express exactly how much I disagree with this man.

"it is a crime that we do not play those games on the systems that we have." Bull! It's EXACTLY the opposite for me. Nintendo consoles are my default consoles. The ones I can always count on purchasing. The other consoles, namely Sony's consoles, I'll only buy if I have extra money.

So, on the contrary, it's the third party titles like Kingdom Hearts III that I really wish could make it onto a "console I have". And although this is a bit off topic (sorry) actually I can say "we" there, as Kingdom Hearts fans with Nintendo consoles have gotten a few KH titles (the last one being quite good), while Microsoft had never seen even a port.

...But that's off-topic. I mean to say that I think exactly the opposite of the man. It's ridiculous how off-base he is.
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02 Dec 2013 12:20

This guy is completely out of touch.
User avatar
02 Dec 2013 12:26

If you look at it from a certain perspective, Nintendo is and has been irrelevant in the console space for years now.
Microsoft and Sony compete, there's no denying that. Nintendo hasn't competed with Microsoft or Sony in the traditional sense since they launched the Wii. You can argue that Wii is a completely separate path to Xbox 360 and PS3, and Wii U also removes itself from the same path as Xbox One and PS4. So in that sense, Nintendo is irrelevant in the console space because they don't operate within that space.

On the other side (and there's not necessarily only two sides) Nintendo has been hugely relevant in the console space at least last gen.
The Wii pioneered an era of motion based gaming, without it we likely would not have seen Kinect or Move materialise. The Wii hit mass market consumers like no console before it. You literally had everyone from toddlers to pensioners playing video games, again unprecedented.

So you can look at it from different sides.

I do think that the "console wars" does not consist of Nintendo anymore. The last "console war" that consisted of a three horse race was the generation of Xbox, Playstation 2, Gamecube. Since then there has been the "console war" and Nintendo doing it's own thing.
And I agree that Nintendo does not produce the best hardware. It's stable and it works, but it's often frustratingly lacking for the time period it is released in.
User avatar
03 Dec 2013 10:39

OmicronTurtle wrote:If you look at it from a certain perspective, Nintendo is and has been irrelevant in the console space for years now.
Microsoft and Sony compete, there's no denying that. Nintendo hasn't competed with Microsoft or Sony in the traditional sense since they launched the Wii. You can argue that Wii is a completely separate path to Xbox 360 and PS3, and Wii U also removes itself from the same path as Xbox One and PS4. So in that sense, Nintendo is irrelevant in the console space because they don't operate within that space.

On the other side (and there's not necessarily only two sides) Nintendo has been hugely relevant in the console space at least last gen.
The Wii pioneered an era of motion based gaming, without it we likely would not have seen Kinect or Move materialise. The Wii hit mass market consumers like no console before it. You literally had everyone from toddlers to pensioners playing video games, again unprecedented.

So you can look at it from different sides.

I do think that the "console wars" does not consist of Nintendo anymore. The last "console war" that consisted of a three horse race was the generation of Xbox, Playstation 2, Gamecube. Since then there has been the "console war" and Nintendo doing it's own thing.
And I agree that Nintendo does not produce the best hardware. It's stable and it works, but it's often frustratingly lacking for the time period it is released in.


if we stick with the definition of console (aka play games) both ps4 and x1 are not console anymore...they are generic computer machines that "also" play games...
so in this way of thinking WiiU is the last console

on the other side you say is only about marketing, being a "console for grandma" is only fault of NOA marketing rep (i think idea is from reggie himself)
but in reality on wii we had some of the best hardcore games of the last generation...the list is huge go check yourself...

also i dont agree with last part "best hardware" thing...
consoles have to be optimezed piece of hardware not like pcs...
so also in this case wii was a hell of engineered piece of hardware...
also the wiiu is incredible for the power they put on video (look at bayonetta to understand, i tried the demo and is really nextgen graphics...if you like consider only the graphics as "next gen") using that poor specs hardware...

for a console gamer "best hardware" means only the level of optimization not the crude horse power, pc gamers can argue that way but not console gamers...
EDIT
cheers
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03 Dec 2013 16:10

I'd say it's the other way around.

PS4 and X1 are essentially the same thing... and on top of that, PC is following the same route, while rendering the console twins obsolete with more power and features.

So basically, by getting Wii U (which offers something different) and a PC which is more of the same (but potentially better), then shouldn't that be the ideal, or rather, truly relevant approach this gaming gen?

Sounds pretty logical to me.
User avatar
04 Dec 2013 05:32

metalpants wrote:I'd say it's the other way around.

PS4 and X1 are essentially the same thing... and on top of that, PC is following the same route, while rendering the console twins obsolete with more power and features.

So basically, by getting Wii U (which offers something different) and a PC which is more of the same (but potentially better), then shouldn't that be the ideal, or rather, truly relevant approach this gaming gen?

Sounds pretty logical to me.


some media start to argue this way now that "nextgen" are out, but for almost a year they only posted against Nintendo overcritizing all Nintendo moves.
now that we got a x86 cisc systems and poor pc porting they start to open eyes...

i know also that if they told the truth about sony and microsoft the entire market could have been collapsed...but anyway i hate they doing this against nintendo...

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