The Legend of Zelda: Skyward Sword

[thresholdXCI]

some of you guys are forgetting that Other M has a development staff that is more than 50% NEAD. Less than 50% Team Ninja. It's a COLLABORATION leaning more toward the Ninty side of things. Not that it should have much to do with Zelda Wii, but im seeing it involved in the conversation

Where did you hear that? I was under the impression TN where making it just with EAD watching over their back.

[joeshabadoo]

"IGN: How is Project M separated between the teams? How big is the overall team?

Yoshio Sakamoto: In addition to the members of the staff from Nintendo and Team Ninja, as you saw in the trailer, there are a lot of cinematics that help us tell the story within Other M so we're also working with a company called D-Rockets, led by a director named Mr. Kitaura. In total, with the the three companies combined that make Project M, we have over 100 people on our staff. "

(wikipedia)
"Metroid: Other M is a video game in development by Team Ninja and Nintendo SPD Production Group 1 (collectively called "Project M")"


"Wired.com: How is the team set up? How many people from Nintendo, how many from Team Ninja?

Sakamoto: As for me personally, the role that I’ve taken on is producer. Also on Nintendo’s side are three other key people who have experienced development on the handheld Metroid games. One gentleman was responsible for designing the maps, another gentleman was actually a designer, so he’s more experienced in developing the visuals of the game, and then we’ve also got one gentleman who was a programmer on the handheld games, and he’s doing more project management.

Hayashi: From the Team Ninja side, there are various programmers and computer graphics designers totaling about 70 people. And then, as we mentioned before, the story element of the game is very significant, and we’ve got a team from a company called D-Rockets, who is also part of Project M, working on the cinematics, and a gentleman by the name of Ryuji Kitaura. So we’ve got about 100 people working on this project."

"If you think about the “three pieces” that Nintendo, Team Ninja, and D-Rockets contribute to make this larger Project M, you can think of it as Team Ninja making the body, and Nintendo making the bloodflow of that body, and D-Rockets supplying the emotion that brings that body to life. One can’t exist without the other, it’s very collaborative."

So just talking pure man-power, yes you have more Team Ninja employees, but the vast majority of those guys are animators/programmers. The actual development minds, decision-makers, managers etc, those are SPD Production Group 1 guys for the most part. But whatever, this stuff should be in the Other: M thread

[NeroSuferoth]

http://seanmalstrom.wordpress.com/2010/01/06/nintendo-cuts-its-losses-on-zelda-wii/

Its from that Malstrom guy.

He´s calling those games "Super Gamecube Games" because they´re appealing to a small public (meaning us) that cant change the tides on a console sales/perception

As much as i want to play Galaxy 2 and Metroid M, i can see he has a point. Its kind of difficult for these games to appeal to anyone other than us (and unfortunally, there´s not too many "us" in this world)

Not necessarily true.. Galaxy sold around 8 million copies and TP sold 5 million. That's a lot of us if you ask me.

The problem with this guy Malstrom is that he is a champion for the casual/expanded audience, he has a grudge with old school and hardcore gamers and the industry so he basically thinks that if a game doesn't sell 50 millions is not a success because is not being assimilated by the expanded audience.

Video games are becoming more mainstream but it's more apparent in one focal group... All games shouldn't appeal to everyone to be a success.

Trust your own judgement.. 5 million is a lot and 8 million is even better.

Now like you said a game like Zelda Wii has the potential to appeal to a much broader audience, not necessarily because of its theme but because of its accessibility trought interaction, that's different.

[thresholdXCI]

Thanks joeshabadoo, I'd never read that interview. With three teams essentially part of the whole project then that sounds like a greater chance of the game being delayed to me.

Back on topic I am sure at least Zelda Wii will be delayed to 2011 for NA/ EU if not that and Metroid. If it's currently slated for a 2010 release then it's going to no doubt be towards the year's end in Japan (it's not even been formally announced as such yet). In which case a western translation will likely push our version back much further.

[Cacildo]

a nice reply with decent points

Yeah, its the first time i read anything from this Maleslrjelrton guy, but i can see he really thinks that if a game dont sell 50million copies and change gaming forever, its a failure.


But yet i can see the point: If the wii have a place in 64 million homes across the world, why cant it sell a single game to at least half of em?

(Obviously this question aint wii bound only. Every console ever sold deserve this type of questioning. But at this moment Wii is the most popular of the bunch, so its nintendo machine on the line)

"You cant please everybody"? Well, there´s movies out there that can please much more than 30 million people.

And these people pay movie tickets per head, meaning if you want to take your wife and two kids to see a movie... well, its almost the price of a wii game.

I found it strange that publishers dont see it that way. That they cant think about products that can appeal to everybody and create multi million sellers.

For me, the exact route to achieve this is the same as the movies: in fact, not the same, but a copy of the movie´s structure: epic thrills, big names and advertising.

A installed base of 60 million consoles for me mean 60million possible consumers of your game. You just need to put some worth on it and let people know.

[NeroSuferoth]

But yet i can see the point: If the wii have a place in 64 million homes across the world, why cant it sell a single game to at least half of em?

"You cant please everybody"? Well, there´s movies out there that can please much more than 30 million people.

For me, the exact route to achieve this is the same as the movies: in fact, not the same, but a copy of the movie´s structure: epic thrills, big names and advertising.

A installed base of 60 million consoles for me mean 60million possible consumers of your game. You just need to put some worth on it and let people know.

I see your point.. but you certainly have to be aware of how unlikelly it would be of half the 60 million Wii user base having the same interests.

Movies do reach a lot of different people, even going by your example a movie that reachs 30 milliom people is still not being watched by a lot more than that because movies are much more mainstream, but like movies there are videogames that can appeal to both core and casual audiences.. think about what movies you meant.

Plus with movies it's the directors job to entertain no matter what and the only thing the audience needs to do is just sit and watch.. with games the epic thrills might be in there but it is the audience who needs to do the job of finding them and that's where either judging by its content, theme and way to interact with them audiences become selective and videogames fall into categories.

I find that Galaxy sold more than Zelda, aside from it being a Mario game, because phantasy appeals more to people, even if the Zelda universe is fictional with some phantasy elements it still could be seen as an medieval adventure with swords and knights.

How can this Zelda reach more people?.. by the way the play it. But it remains to be seen if that will be enough.

[cortjezter]

But yet i can see the point: If the wii have a place in 64 million homes across the world, why cant it sell a single game to at least half of em?

"You cant please everybody"? Well, there´s movies out there that can please much more than 30 million people.

And these people pay movie tickets per head, meaning if you want to take your wife and two kids to see a movie... well, its almost the price of a wii game.

I found it strange that publishers dont see it that way. That they cant think about products that can appeal to everybody and create multi million sellers.

wow.. this thread is getting horribly off-topic. can we please tie it back to new Zelda Wii info??

i'll do my best to take where we left off and bring it back around.

i think price is definitely a factor. even though you CAN get the numbers for 3-4 movie tickets to come out to the price of most wii games, the perception of value is key. 10-12 bucks (per person) still FEELS like a smaller price, even if you multiply it 4 times. even so, 30 million tickets wouldn't equal 30 million game sales; you'd have to divide by 3-4 to reach the same number of families...at least by that math.

plus, there's less commitment. you can watch a trailer and get a reasonably good idea what to expect. if you sit down in the theatre and find out twenty minutes in that you hate it, 9/10 times you can walk out and get your money back, sometimes even if you've already watched the whole thing.

if that wasn't enough, movies play to just about anyone with a pulse. no special hardware required, unlike games, which require a large investment in hardware (console, tv, controllers, software, etc), and a larger investment of time. movies are positioned to be excellent impulse entertainment buys; games are not. that's why it's much easier to sell 30M tickets than it would be to sell 30M copies of a game...you'd need a hardware install base of at least as many citizens as can go to the movie theatre.

if you look at the ps2 with it's 130 million or-so units, how many of its games sold to half its base? i don't personally believe that's a flaw of any developer or publisher and their approach. if anything it would be a flaw of whoever designed human beings, since we're all so different with unique preferences...something that anyone working with the public (or, say, running a gaming site) learns very quickly: you can never, ever please everyone; you're lucky if you can ever get a fraction. i'd say developers releasing mini-game collections are probably coming as close as possible to something that could ever try to appeal to everyone. unfortunately those collections don't include the kind of deep experiences most players can get from standalone titles, so while a dev can get near an "appeal" to everyone, the product doesn't deliver as rich an experience. but it is possible to develop something that hits on themes and experiences that appeal at a more basic human level than specific activities. this is the difference between many nintendo games and other companies. where one developer may create something that centers around blasting nazis or battling hordes of zombies--a specific activity, story or genre--another developer like nintendo will focus on something more basic that is fun, like simple, incremental challenges, and build a game around that. popcap is another company that has learned very well what can appeal to almost anyone. but even they can't sell those broadly appealing games to anywhere near half of any console's user base.

i do however think that many developers have just been lazy when it comes to the wii, perhaps thinking that throwing any old game out to a huge crowd will net enough return, but i doubt it, and it's clear that approach doesn't work very well. that's how spammers do it... send their crap to millions of people and hope a fraction respond. well, when we have to pay for it, people respond even less. if you support us, we will support you. and that doesn't just mean make a good game and we'll buy it. you need to get the word out, market it however necessary, and then follow-through on all of those promises and touch points.

so what does that mean for zelda wii? well, we honestly don't know enough about the game to know its audience or direction, but that it's supposed to be a refreshing new entry, vs the now tiring old formula. that means it should be aiming to please new people too, which also means nintendo will need to do a little marketing...ideally more than their typical lone tv commercial or banner ads online. usually zelda games arent ones that need a lot of buzz, but if they are planning to release it this year, they need to start building more awareness NOW. not hype. awareness.

[SSB Fan]

I'm sure that I'm getting this for Christmas in 2010. Lol, Christmas just ended twenty-five days ago and we're already starting to make wishlists for Christmas in 2010!

[rayhanc8]

So far we have heard many rumours about zelda wii and so far it seems it is going to be a majoras mask sequel, I for one do not mind that but for gods sake do not a stupid 3 day time limit, ive played mm and its good but the time limit is really hindering and quite confusing, however maybe i might grow to it once i play further in mm (only on first dungeon, exams stopping me playing games for long). I will not mind a mm sequel in terms of story and charecters however as I do like mm. I do not really get why so many people love mm so much though, i prefer oot, better epic story in my honest opinion,
anyway zelda wii is sounding good, hopefully it is
roll on e3

[Ezekiel Rage]

well, the way i see it the game shows two outcomes:

The Prophet of Light Rumor:
This Rumor places the game as sequel to majoras mask, with the same link in adulthood.

The Fall of Hyrule Rumor
THis Rumor places the game as Sequel to Ocarina of Time, with a new Link or possibly the same link in Adult Form (however that works) and details the downfall of hyrule that leads to its flooding.

As for me, id wish for the fall of hyrule to be the one here. they should tie this into the intro to zelda2 on nes.

vaati being the scorceer who hexxes zelda. they bring her away as the flood comes down to the new hyrule, the very same hyrule tetra discovers after phantom hourglass. that would fit zelda 1+2 after spirit tracks and fix enormous parts of the timeline while providing a dark and epic experience to the players.

but alas, i probably never get this story, for it would just be too epic and dark for nintendo i guess

i expect another basic zelda story...

[Barto]

With E3 2010 one very Long day away, Zelda Wii excitement is at an all time high.
Predctions, speculations, and rumor are flying around left and right but it all really comes down to what's gonna be shown come Tuesday morning.

Now I have to say I've NEVER been more excited to see what the Big N's been working on. Even the hype Twilght Princess brought couldn't match my anticipation now.

Miyamoto promises change and that's got me super pumped, because IMO TP was just a lot of more of the same. Nearly every Zelda before TP brought with it something that made it so I could fall in love with and explore a whole new world. With TP, I just didn't feel that no matter how hard I tried.

The one thing that's got me quite nervous though, is the art direction they're going to take with Zelda Wii. Miyamoto and team have hinted that it's not gonna change drastically from TP and that one concept drawing supports that. Miyamoto also says and he and the team feel pressured to match Monster Hunter Tri's graphics and while they are quite impressive, the art style seemed quite plain to me. Zelda, to me has always been a fantasy game and TP's artstyle seemed to just try and make the world as realistic as possible. (aside from the Twilight. I thought that was done quite well)

one might argue that links n64 outings did the same, but to me, the style gave the world and it's characters a certain charm that were unique to those games.

I feel like I'm just rambling now so I'll stop here. =]
bottom line: I hope that if Ninendo DOES continue with TPs art direction, then I hope they do SOMETHING to breathe some more life into the world. Use brighter colors in the color pallette or something.
They don't have to change as drastically like the Wind Waker, but Im afraid that if the artstyle doesn't change, then the game will lose it's sense of wonder and I won't feel as compelled to explore it....then again Majoras Mask used the same engine as Ocarina so...idk
Ninetendos Presser can't come soon enough!=]

[Skooter]

I absolutely agree. My biggest gripe with Twilight Princess is honestly the how... bland the colour palette is. I don't mind it much for one game, but I reaaaally hope that's not what all console Zelda's are going to look like D:.

I'm fine with keeping Toon Link for the handhelds, but just a little more colour, a little more fun and I'd be happy!

[Gulshog]

I still say that a futuristic Legend of Zelda with a robotic link, with a master sword that is really a key to his emotions/heart, and his heart is actually Zelda, yet Zelda is actually a flesh and blood person, and Link realizes he is a hologram/character inside of a virtual reality program that she created.

Never happen...

[RustyCage]

I think I'd like the emphasis to be on richer colors, rather than just brighter colors. Majora's Mask is an example of a dark game that was still very colorful compared to Twilight Princess. It doesn't have to be bright, and the mood doesn't have to be lifted, for it to be colorful.

But really I think my reasoning for wanting more color is that I'd like to have a Zelda game that feels like it's cram-packed with magic. I want to feel it from the environments, and color can be incredibly important toward that, even if it's not 'bright happy' color. Guillermo del Toro does a good job with serious/dark stories that still feel visually alive and full of color and magic. I'd look to his films (Pan's Labyrinth, Hellboy, etc) for inspiration.

[Gulshog]

I'd look to his films (Pan's Labyrinth, Hellboy, etc) for inspiration.

Pan's Labyrinth is an amazing movie, and anything that is inspired by it would be a must buy for me.

[Chosenoneknuckles]

A colourful [yet with a touch of 'realism'] cel-shaded art direction is what I'm hoping they decided on way back then [the whole 'pursuit for photo realism' buzz wore out ages ago now, so I prefer the likes of SMG2, Okami, WW, ToMI - games with an actual creative style - visually now], personally.

[TYFIGHTER]

Sweet baby Jesus. The game looks incredible. Hopefully it was just Miyamoto and the interference that was causing the controls to go crazy. But the artstyle is incredible and the game looks truly awesome. I seriously cant describe how excited I am. I have a feeling it can be the best Zelda yet, with the new controls.

I LOVE YOU NINTENDO <3

[MAGNUS-8M]

This is almost exactly what I wanted. At one time, I had thought that while Nintendo was going to use WM+ for sword-fighting, it'd be neat if another Zelda game developed by a close 3rd Party or 2nd Party would use WM+ to quickly grab an item from your inventory. One of the most annoying out-of-game experiences in the 3D(and even 2D) Zelda games, for me, was having to pause the game to grab an item from my inventory - especially for boss battles that required more items used than I was able to keep assigned to C-buttons/directions.

But they managed to do both, and a lot of what was shown was more or less all WM+ controlled rather than just a quick IR point and click. Haha, even Wii Sports Bowling controls got added. Very impressed.

[Skooter]

Obviously, I am ridiculously pleased about the graphic style.
The live control issues were disappointing, but I have no doubt that it'll work a billion times better when we actually buy it. (How soon until we can expect info from people who tried it out at E3?)

[TYFIGHTER]

(How soon until we can expect info from people who tried it out at E3?)

Probably later today. Thats almost guaranteed. Hopefully we'll have a video of the full demo too!!

*EDIT* IGN has impressions up! They say it works perfectly! Everyone stop worrying!
http://wii.ign.com/articles/109/1097952p1.html

[Chosenoneknuckles]

A colourful [yet with a touch of 'realism'] cel-shaded art direction is what I'm hoping they decided on way back then [the whole 'pursuit for photo realism' buzz wore out ages ago now, so I prefer the likes of SMG2, Okami, WW, ToMI - games with an actual creative style - visually now], personally.

Oh I love it when I'm right!

[Jirachi]

i gotta say i wasn't excepting skyward sword to be shown that early in the show.
I REALLY like this graphic style it's both tp and ww mixed into one :p
it's too bad i can't edit this threads title to skyward sword xD

[Ezekiel Rage]

tell a mod to edito it four you
anyway, i already said that, but i just LOVE the graphical style.
here are some things ive seen in the trailers:

link is right handed. too bad. maybe there is a leftie option?
the graphics are far more detailed thatn TP. you may not realize it, but it is true. the level of detail already is imense.

the difficulty was ramped up. in a playthrough, you can see the boss makes you lose 1 heart per hit. one full heart. yay

the way you slice is important. can only kill certain enemies with the right slices (like red steel 2)

the pause between hit and fallback of enemies has been reduced, but is still there.
link has the master sword early on in the game. that makes me think that there are other weapons involved.

the scorpion boss followed typical zelda formula, but took more hits to kill.

looks like the level we saw was actually a dungeon. that would fit with the seamless comment from earlier.

the girl was nowhere to be found, and link had both sword and shield. whats up with that?

[Chosenoneknuckles]

the girl was nowhere to be found, and link had both sword and shield. whats up with that?

Then she's either:

- The one who made the Master Sword [assuming that narrative is still the case]
- Or related to one that did / partook in its creation
- ... Or is the sword [as theorised].

I guess if there is any co-op portions, then it won't be of Link and Zelda, but of that girl and Link.

[TYFIGHTER]

Mixing both art styles was pure genius.In Wii Sports Resort I loved the sword mode, i'm gonna be loving me some Skyward Sword.If they bring back the ocarina or a some kinda flute I will die of happiness.

YES. I really hope they have a cool instrument in this one. Thats one thing I hated about TP, the howling was stupid and underused. Music is a huge part of Zelda! The flute in Spirit Tracks was the coolest instrument yet, because you actually played it! Hopefully with MotionPlus they can think of something really awesome you actually "play"!