Fascist IRC moderators...

[Jørn Hansen]

I have noticed some of your moderators on your IRC are abusing their status. In several discussions people with different opinions have been kicked for having a diametrically opposite opinion than of the moderator.

True, that in most cases the kicked person runs a juvenile discussion, but this is nothing new on the IRC. It seems as long you agree with the mod and/or are buddies with him (I say him, cause I have yet to see a female mod abuse her status), you can type what ever you want.

I have resently been kicked out for over 24 hours because I commented on a moderator CLEARLY abusing his status.

BTW I go under the name "oslo" in the IRC, so any of you mods can take your stabs at me....

[thewster]

That's weird. When I'm on there it's never happened....

Of course I don't talk too much on IRC. Who was the mod who kicked you?

[JuanotheGamer]

I too have noticed this. Recently I was banned for a week without reason by a certain Op (whom I will not name).

[t27duck]

I too have noticed this. Recently I was banned for a week without reason by a certain Op (whom I will not name).

...I thought it was because you kept typing in all caps...

[cortjezter]

if someone has specific complaints about an IRC mod, please forward the info to me, including the name of the mods giving trouble. i will confront whomever is responsible, and try to resolve the matter.

i've been hearing several complaints over the past couple months, but as i understand it, the mod team for IRC has been shaken up some since those complaints. if we continue to have problems, it wouldn't be a problem for us to switch our IRC to another server, and choose new mods by application.

the IRC was started as a way to enable more instant communication between members, but as with any community, it only takes a few bad apples to ruin it for the rest--regular user, moderator; doesn't matter.

[kuraitenshikun]

You have yet to see a female abuse their powers because the only one that has any is Bethany, and she never does anything. Although, she certainly takes the time to unban her friends.

Juano, you're a spammer and an idiot. (No, I didn't ban him.)

[JuanotheGamer]

You have yet to see a female abuse their powers because the only one that has any is Bethany, and she never does anything. Although, she certainly takes the time to unban her friends.

Juano, you're a spammer and an idiot. (No, I didn't ban him.)

Whoa, whoa, whoa, I didnt come here talking trash about you. Maybe because YOU abused your powers was the reason you were unOped.

[t27duck]

Hey hey! Play nice you two.

[kuraitenshikun]

Sorry, duck. It just agitates me when people throw the abuse card so readily. I don't remember what happened with oslo, but I do believe that it was probably merited.

People tend to not see the entirety of exchanges and obstructions, which provokes them to develop self-praising, vigilante in response to their misinformation. Thus, "abusing" may not actually be abuse, merely the misinterpretation of an action by an ignorant individual that happened to spectate one severed scene, who thereby continues to pursue the ultimate removal of such ban (ironically, leading to their own temporary ban), despite what they do and/or don't know.

Another that happens often, as is expected in such communities, is the clique who whines and complains continuously and demands ardently that some injustice be corrected because one of their "friends" has been rightly removed. This often leads to a ban, albeit rarely permanent, simply due to their inability to shut up in some righteous crusade to obtain the coveted pardon for their obviously deserving buddy.

I won't say I've never abused my late status (although, not nearly as often as people say), but I will say that the current Ops are entirely capable and as fair as can be expected. Most of these complaints are either misunderstandings or someone who can't stand not being able to do anything and get away with it.

People have a problem with any governing body that is visibly active and present. Unlike a forum, administration of a chat requires more frequency, and often more severity.

As is often how events like these transpire, those who have a problem are those that speak up, and they speak up together. It is far less often, and with fewer numbers, that they acknowledge what you've done correct -- whether out of laziness or indifference. People have a tendency to speak up more when they're bothered than when they're comfortable with a situation. Take note of this.

This is just a general observation, and not a response to oslo in particular.

Personally, I would be happy to see CortJezter preside over the #Gonintendo IRC channel. I know that, like his administration of the message boards, he'd be an able and present applicant. Unlike the current owner, he'd be present, and actually contact the Ops when something is brought to his attention, rather than believing anything a persistent, yet lying, visitor says without even contacting the Op that was accused.

Go for it, CJ. The current Ops, including Ragnarok who wasn't added to the auto-op list, are still worthy of their position. The only that may not be are gamblor, because he's never around and Bethany, because she's never around and never did/does anything. Obviously, that's my opinion, but I did recruit gamblor.

As for myself, I probably deserved my Op status being taken away. It wouldn't have been the case were the higher powers more thorough (meaning doing ANYTHING) in their investigation, and my initial ban and subsequent bans thereafter, would have stuck. Unfortunately, the person in charge doesn't look at the facts.

[8 bit]

You have yet to see a female abuse their powers because the only one that has any is Bethany, and she never does anything. Although, she certainly takes the time to unban her friends.

Juano, you're a spammer and an idiot. (No, I didn't ban him.)

Just wanted to say some things, even if I don't have that much to do with this discussion, because I mostly enter the IRC to chat about recent happenings and tend to speak only with people who play the games I do, so I don't take part in many discussions. That said, here they are:

- First, when I have entered the IRC, I've seen people banned and kicked out, for violating the chat rules, so no problem there. The rules are to be followed.

- Second, I do perceive when entering that some mods act in a "bossy" way, typical of many board/chat moderators who's priviledges tend to "cloud their vision". Just a matter of pulling them down to the ground.

- Third is another thing I've seen. That is the mods kicking some people out for a given reason and "not paying attention" when other certain members are being a pain. The relationship between them I do not know.

- Lastly, from what I've seen, I don't think Juano is neither a spammer or an idiot. Go figure.

[cortjezter]

People have a problem with any governing body that is visibly active and present. Unlike a forum, administration of a chat requires more frequency, and often more severity.

i definitely believe there is truth to this, especially online where more freedom is afforded than any other place on earth, really. so when rules are imposed and enforced in an online community, some people just don't or won't accept them, for good or bad. i can personally attest to this even in our own community... people have screamed bloody murder for having their spamalicious posts deleted, called me all sorts of things, and gone to just about any length to get my ousted; all so they could say and do whatever they wanted.

that said, i am still fully capable of running and moderating the boards by myself at with its current activity. however, i do believe in fairness, and have added 4 people to join as moderators to help balance out the duties, as well as add the perspective and judgement of those people to my own in running the boards. a group of people tends to afford a wider spectrum of fairness than just one

i've talked with at least a dozen people now about the situation and have heard both sides, including proposed solutions. while i appreciate the sort-of nomination for admin of the IRC, between my job, helping run this site--including moderating the boards, combined with my relative inexperience with the features and commands of IRC, it may not be the best time or fit for me right now. but i know that someone out there DOES fit.

what i'm leaning toward at the moment is to do a complete slate cleaning of the IRC--removing all OPs, removing all bans, chartering a new set of rules that more directly resemble appropriate conduct for discussion here on the boards, etc. we would keep the same server and room, but would transfer room ownership to a GN staffer, plus post a story opening applications for dedicated IRC OPs. for those who currently serve in an OP capacity, they would be welcome to reapply, and would be considered to serve again, effectively keeping those that deserve the position, and weeding out any who might not.

but i alone am not qualified to judge these applications, so would establish a group of several people all familiar with IRC and/or the community, who could choose a new team.

it would be sort of a fresh start... when it first opened, the owner and OPs would keep me and others in the loop. these days, i couldn't tell you a thing about the management of the room, including the people responsible. hopefully a little housecleaning would invite an atmosphere people can be comfortable using, rules and all.

[SteveC1990]

[spoiler]People have a problem with any governing body that is visibly active and present. Unlike a forum, administration of a chat requires more frequency, and often more severity.[/spoiler]

[spoiler]i definitely believe there is truth to this, especially online where more freedom is afforded than any other place on earth, really. so when rules are imposed and enforced in an online community, some people just don't or won't accept them, for good or bad. i can personally attest to this even in our own community... people have screamed bloody murder for having their spamalicious posts deleted, called me all sorts of things, and gone to just about any length to get my ousted; all so they could say and do whatever they wanted.

that said, i am still fully capable of running and moderating the boards by myself at with its current activity. however, i do believe in fairness, and have added 4 people to join as moderators to help balance out the duties, as well as add the perspective and judgement of those people to my own in running the boards. a group of people tends to afford a wider spectrum of fairness than just one

i've talked with at least a dozen people now about the situation and have heard both sides, including proposed solutions. while i appreciate the sort-of nomination for admin of the IRC, between my job, helping run this site--including moderating the boards, combined with my relative inexperience with the features and commands of IRC, it may not be the best time or fit for me right now. but i know that someone out there DOES fit.

what i'm leaning toward at the moment is to do a complete slate cleaning of the IRC--removing all OPs, removing all bans, chartering a new set of rules that more directly resemble appropriate conduct for discussion here on the boards, etc. we would keep the same server and room, but would transfer room ownership to a GN staffer, plus post a story opening applications for dedicated IRC OPs. for those who currently serve in an OP capacity, they would be welcome to reapply, and would be considered to serve again, effectively keeping those that deserve the position, and weeding out any who might not.

but i alone am not qualified to judge these applications, so would establish a group of several people all familiar with IRC and/or the community, who could choose a new team.

it would be sort of a fresh start... when it first opened, the owner and OPs would keep me and others in the loop. these days, i couldn't tell you a thing about the management of the room, including the people responsible. hopefully a little housecleaning would invite an atmosphere people can be comfortable using, rules and all.[/spoiler]

i totally agree. A fresh start in the ICR chat is whats needed. I myself dont enter the rooms that much, i stick to the boards more often than not but on occasions i have seen people being kicked out for reasons that no-one could tell, although not being in the chat i could not tell you the mod...

And just to say, someone said above that bethany is rarely on the boards, everytime i have gone into the chat, she is present... just a random fact there!

[gamemaster166]

whenever someone does not agree with one of the mods, they just get angry and kick us out of the IRC. it would be wonderful to get a fresh start

[kuraitenshikun]

And just to say, someone said above that bethany is rarely on the boards, everytime i have gone into the chat, she is present... just a random fact there!

Just being in the chat doesn't make someone there. It's generally called idling, among the IRC folk. I said she never did anything, short of helping her friends.

It wasn't random, or a fact.

EDIT

I was talking with some of the Ops, and none said they were contacted by you, Cort. I thought you heard both sides? -_-;

[UnitZerOne]

why-a everyboady gotta be-a so angry.

i'v been in the IRC a few times, and seen some childish users get kicked. I'v seen some childish users not get kicked.

I think the whole thing is subjective to the individual ops interpritation.

I think they do the best they can, most of the time.

A little attitude is good some time. it helps keeping over zelous users from trying to overstep their bounds. But, at the same time, it intimidates the more docile or recreational user. So, its kinda give and take. Im sure everyone has an Op or 2 whom they prefer to chat under.

Its a society everyone, not a utpoia.

[Big_J]

From being in the chat tonight... its not accessible to everyone, somthing I kNOW RMC wants, the ops would NOT unmute the room until it reached "normal lvls" which was 40 users i guess... So anyone new who wanted to stay had to leave cause they were unable to talk until there were only 40 users, you cant control chaos in IRC when GoNintendo puts on a Live show its just not possible without turning people away, which GoNintendo does not want done. I think this leaves people who joined the IRC to have fun and ask some questions with a very bad taste in their mouth when they leave.

Yes there are awlays going to be trouble makers in any chat, but what the OP's are currently doing is setting up their *OWN* chat room, not a GoNintendo one, that place is not user friendly.

Yes I started the chat along time ago and yes it might have been that way under me but now I see it from the normal user side of things, and its not a firendly place.

I know Ku is back, hopefully he can take charge and do the right thing with it.

PS: when doing the Live camera podcast the staff should stick to the stickam chat room until the GoNintendo IRC crew can get its mess cleaned up.

[MidnightScott]

First of all...

I would like to defend most of the ops actions.

Many of the people who came into the chat room, spammed it to hell. They asked the same questions over and over again, even when we told them No or the answer. So after they kept repeating it, they were kicked.

Most people only get banned when they come in the chatroom just to be annoying (AKA a "Troll")...or when they keep annoying the rest of the people in the chatroom. Also, many of the times people get kicked when an Op tells them to stop arguing or telling them to stop doing something else when they don't listen.

I myself think Ku, and Ragnarok are great Ops and should be auto-opped (if they aren't already.)

I'm in the GoNintendo IRC everyday, and know how to use commands and whatnot...

However, I just think immature brats need to stop coming in the chatroom and annoying the hell out of everyone else. One time some idiot kept spamming everyone using the /notice command...probably some fool who was banned for being ignorant in the first place.

I'm sorry, but I think the Ops are fair most of the time, that's my two cents.

Oh yeah, and you can do something about the situation. Make a new channel called #GoNintendoPodcast and let them go spam the hell out of that. Then we don't have to worry about the main chat being flooded with 50 messages a second by fools who ask the same things a million times.

Oh yeah, and Juano, we don't give a crap about WiiTV, stop coming in the chat and whining about it, and sending us links, and all of that crap. It's getting ANNOYING.

[MalikHalo]

Tonight, I went in the IRC for the podcast, and I have to say, the OPs came off as jerks.

They seemed to have that high and mighty kind of air about them. Like, people were typing along to a song the podcast crew was singing after the show, and Ku muted everybody. I believe he made a comment that was something like, "I couldn't stand that." You personally not liking something doesn't seem like a valid reason to do that.

Then he asks, "Was that over the line?" or something similar. Of course, every regular user was muted and couldn't say anything, so only the OPs could answer. Like someone who is able to talk will say "Yeah, that was unfair."

If the OPs are half as devoted as everyone acts like they are, you'd think they could tough it out 2 or 3 hours per week. All the regulars have the chat to themselves the rest of the time.

[Delio]

You know from observing this thread i have to comment. Ku was doing his job and from what i have seen wasent acting for some personal Bias. Spamming the chat with one line with everyone repeating it ever second is not good. I sure as heck know i cant carry a conversation when some is spouting out "I want the pretty lady on the podcast!" every five seconds.

Also i Strongly dont agree with opening the room up fully and letting a flood of people come in to the point it gets out of hand. You need order in a chatroom and opening it up and allowing such chaos to happen for the sake of the podcast is rather dumb.

[cortjezter]

i wish i could have been around to help out, and also see first-hand how things went down. unfortunately after the site went down, while i hung out giving people updates on the site's reparation progress, an electrical storm knocked out my internet most of the night

it sounds like depending on one's position (regular or OP) or intention (ask a podcast question, spam, moderate, etc), the experience varied wildly, which mostly mirrors what i've learned previously from my talks with a variety of people.

the current plan is to replace the current chat admin with a GN staffer or Ku, mainly because the current is nearly unreachable, and thus ineffective in running the room. ku has demonstrated ability and fairness both on the boards and as a previous OP, and his reputation is respectable.

from there we will open the doors for applications for OPs, ckear the ban lists, as well as charter a new set of rules that more closely reflects the kind of conduct appropriate here on the boards, but obviously tailored where necessary for a live forum. any current OPs who wish to remain on will have the ability to formally present themselves during this process. one of the site's ideals is that we do not want to turn anyone away, ever, if at all possible, and hopefully this will give opportunity to have a more inclusive, rewarding chat room.

as far as other critiques of moderators' actions, i fully support and mods here on the boards or OPs in the chat who take action in order to do their jobs. it isn't about controlling people, but enforcing a set of rules that intend to make something more enjoyable or usable. if someone or something is disturbing the rest of the community or an OPs ability to do their job, i would expect them to take appropriate action to regain that ability, even if it means silencing a busy crowd momentarily. especially in a live setting--and i've seen this numerous times during things like live 'celebrity' chats--the rules of moderation require more proactive steps to filter content to the intended target, so if the room had been set to 'quiet' or whatever the term is, i'm sure it wasn't so detrimental to the normal users' experience that it was beyond unbearable and meriting a complaint.

anyway, i hope despite the madness, most people were able to enjoy a live feed, the energy of the crowd, and at least some of the fruits of a live chat with the podcast crew. it could always be worse... an electrical storm could have prevented you from enjoying or not enjoying all of the 2-year anniversary festivities as was my case! :-\

[JuanotheGamer]

You know, I could do pretty well as an Op...

Oh yeah, and Juano, we don't give a crap about WiiTV, stop coming in the chat and whining about it, and sending us links, and all of that crap. It's getting ANNOYING.

The ONLY reason I mentioned WiiTV last night was because it was a question to RMC, because they called him out on the Zack and Wiki campaign. THATS IT. Maybe YOU, should be the one who stops saying "I got my Pokemon DSL" OMG POLAR DSL NOT ENOUGH FOR ME" "$329 well spent!"

EDIT" WTF? I woke up banned?

[t27duck]

MotherBrain cloned herself 99 times. Each of them had a microphone 2 inches from their faces. 20 of them started laughing. 20 of them started talking about Buddy non-stop, 30 of them each talked about something different. 20 of them said the same thing but each of the 20 is out of sync with each other by like 5-20 milliseconds. The last 10 only said stuff every once in a while. Meanwhile RMC with his 4 other clones try to calm them all down because he can't figure out what any of them are saying.

That's how I describe chat last night for the 33-50% of the podcast that I was in it.



On topic:

With the possible exception to banning Jauno, everything Ku and the the Op with the long name that I can never remember I back. When I was in Chat, did they their job the best they can.

TALKING IN CAPS isn't proper conduct.

Repeating the same thing isn't proper conduct.
Repeating the same thing isn't proper conduct.
Repeating the same thing isn't proper conduct.
Repeating the same thing isn't proper conduct.
HEY FORUM: REPEATING THE SAME THING!!!!111!!one!!!!

[MidnightScott]

You know, I could do pretty well as an Op...

Never going to happen.

Oh yeah, and Juano, we don't give a crap about WiiTV, stop coming in the chat and whining about it, and sending us links, and all of that crap. It's getting ANNOYING.

The ONLY reason I mentioned WiiTV last night was because it was a question to RMC, because they called him out on the Zack and Wiki campaign. THATS IT. Maybe YOU, should be the one who stops saying "I got my Pokemon DSL" OMG POLAR DSL NOT ENOUGH FOR ME" "$329 well spent!"

EDIT" WTF? I woke up banned?

LOL, there is a difference between bragging and spamming. You keep whining to us about WiiTV, and The Kid leaving. Exactly who gives a damn besides you? We know already...you talk about it EVERYDAY. Sending us links to the site, etc.

I had no idea what you did last night in the chat because I left when all of the idiots came in there repeating the same thing every second. I'm sorry, but how does a chat run smoothly if there are 50 messages a second? How do you keep a convo going in that crap?

[Ragnarok]

Frankly, last night's chat was a disaster. I think it was a huge mistake having the podcast chat in the main gonintendo chat room. A temporary channel should have been created for the event (for the same reasons these forums have a separate forum for podcast discussion; except people in IRC talk a million times faster). The ops were only trying to quell the madness. If you don't think this warranted muting the chat I don't know what does: http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v382/ ... amchat.jpg

I didn’t really moderate much last night since it was such an uncontrollable mess, but I think the other ops did the best they could given the situation. It had to be muted a few times to stop the spam and calm everyone down and believe me, it needed to be muted. I think the Q&A chat was a good idea, but having it in the main chat was a very bad idea.

[MalikHalo]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v382/RagnarokX/spamchat.jpg

I'm glad you got a picture of that, because that's what I was referencing.

I would've agreed with you 100% if it was any situation except for last night's. What did RMC say before he started playing that song? Something along the lines of "I need some help on this." Now was he talking to us or to the other podcast members? I don't know, he didn't specify. In retrospect, it probably wasn't us, but there was no specification, so why wouldn't we go along with the song?

I honestly think you guys could mod a chat that big. It'd help to set up ground rules and do whatever it is you do that would make the rules show every time you entered the chat. If you already did that, I didn't see it. You could always mute everyone right before the podcast starts, then post the rules that apply during podcast time. Then you could say, I dunno, you get kicked the first two times, then banned for 4 or 5 hours so you'd miss the rest of the time the podcast crew is in the IRC and the feed is up.