Is the 3DS really underpowered? Or is it hiding its true...

[omega59]

Is the 3DS really underpowered hardwarewise to the sony vita? I think not. the 3ds, roughly is as detailed as the wii, except no full motion controls except tilt sensitivity. I would say it is limiting itself, like the difference in sharpness between the Legend of Zelda Twilight Princess, and The Legend of Zelda Skyward Sword? It's all about the end though, come to think of it, when the system is nearly phased out that they show you what it can really do.

What do you think? Is it or is it not an underpowered system? Is it hiding its potential?

[motherbra1n]

well heres the thing, judging purely from gameplay videos and trailers on youtube, resident evil revelations doesn't look much worse than uncharted golden abyss, so I think maybe a bit.

[gtt]

compared to the vita? yea, it's underpowered. and the vita screen is amazing.

[TheLastBlade]

I wouldn't know; not an expert on technology (though the Vita is probably stronger).

[CaptainColon]

Compared to PS Vita, yeah, the 3DS is the weaker system hardware wise. But that doesn't mean it can't still produce some nice looking games.

[Mirr0rR3flection]

Yay its underpowered -_- but who really cares anyway? What should matter are the games not the power of the hardware.

[ddddd]

Yay its underpowered -_- but who really cares anyway? What should matter are the games not the power of the hardware.

Dont forget, that power can determine if the system gets some games.

[Mirr0rR3flection]

Yay its underpowered -_- but who really cares anyway? What should matter are the games not the power of the hardware.

Dont forget, that power can determine if the system gets some games.

Oh yay, I forgot about that detail.

(Wii )

[MAGNUS-8M]

If VIta's sales pick up, and third-parties make games mostly meant for Vita's power, then have to decide whether it's a good idea financially to port it to the 3DS or not... that's when 3DS will be 'underpowered'. Or, if they decided they wanted to make a cross-platform console game and a 3DS-port was part of that, it'd be viewed as underpowered.

Otherwise... it's basically in a class by itself. Yeah, Vita is pretty far ahead of it, but so far Vita's also viewed as 'more expensive than the 3DS' and 'more expensive than some smartphone plans' rather than 'wow it's graphics-hardware is so much more powerful'. Which, hopefully it becomes more about what games each system has that draws people to it rather than 'whoa, a PS3 in my pocket means the games are so much better than 3DS for some reason', but who knows.

Seriously, if people's interests are ranging from playing Angry Birds to Super Mario Land 3D to Uncharted on the go, it doesn't seem like raw-power is as big of an issue at the moment. As long as they can make a game that makes good use of what each system can offer, they should do fine... it's just that moment when they have to choose between each system that would make one underpowered compared to the other. And it just seems kind of strange to make portable-gaming the grounds for that kind of battle when it's more important to consider game-length and the type of gaming you can do on a portable device, rather than worry about whether it can render a sprawling world or not.

It's up to them, though. But to me, on a mobile platform where people could be playing anything from Tetris to fully-polygonal worlds, it doesn't make much sense to make outrageous claims about what one system can do over the other. It's just when the developer or publisher themselves decide to make a game that specifically requires Vita's power, and then claim it really can't be downsized or otherwise realized on 3DS' hardware that it becomes an issue. Personally I'm happy with what the 3DS can do, and I have no problem with it, but if they made a Vita-only game from a series I like, I'd be annoyed I couldn't play/afford the things I'd need to have it, or at least annoyed that the developer/publisher didn't want to make a decent 3DS-port of it.

[Bonampak]

Yay its underpowered -_- but who really cares anyway? What should matter are the games not the power of the hardware.

Dont forget, that power can determine if the system gets some games.

The N64 would love to have a word with you.

[Mako]

The N64 would love to have a word with you.

The big problem with the N64 was that is used cartridges as opposed to a disc based system like its competitor. Sure, cartridges had better loading times and cut down on piracy, but they were much more expensive to produce and had higher licensing fees. 3rd parties saw this and jumped to the cheaper to produce CD...

Then again, the Gamecube doesn't play DVD and instead uses a different proprietary disc. This cut down on piracy, which Nintendo is always trying to do, but hurt them in the long run. Many people bought the PS2 at first because it doubled as a DVD player and naturally the support was still there from 3rd parties.

Both times the more powerful system lost, but doesn't that almost always happen? lol

On topic: Obviously as time goes on we will continue to see better looking 3DS games. Usually it takes a while for devs to really understand how the system works and to make games run at their full potential. For example, we are still seeing PS3 games continue to look better and better. However, I don't think 3DS comes close to what Vita can produce...

[L Thammy]

Is the 3DS less powerful than the Vita? Yes it is. The Vita isn't actually as powerful as a PS3 and the 3DS isn't actually as weak as a Wii, but there is definitely a gap. Is that a bad thing? Not at all.

A large part of the original DS' success came from being a fairly weak platform, and as a result, a cheap platform to produce games for. That means that not all games have to be triple A successes to do well on the platform, so it's easier for smaller developers and less traditional games.

[omega59]

Well i do know this, the 3DS is much better pricewise for what it can do: netflix, facebook, these forums here, google, 3D video. it has a batterylife of 5 hours or so full screen brightness and using wifi. the sony vita said the same, except it was on the lowest possible power usage. 3DS comes with a free 2gb sd card. the vita needs a memory card bought seperaty before you use it. the 3DS is better for the price by having things packaged with it for free. the 3DS has a lot to pack into something 1/4 inch thick for the bottom section. And yes i really do use my 3ds on this site (for the mildly curious)

[ddddd]

The N64 would love to have a word with you.

Cartridges vs Discs. Which is why I said "CAN" and not "WILL".

[Bonampak]

The N64 would love to have a word with you.

Cartridges vs Discs. Which is why I said "CAN" and not "WILL".

You were talking about the system not the format, though. Since that's exactly the topic at hand.

Besides, the most powerful console/handheld usually doesn't dominate. It rarely does.

GB > GameGear

DS > PSP

PS1 > N64

PS2> Xbox 1

Wii/X360 > PS3

3DS > too early to tell... but things look mighty good for the 3DS already.

[ddddd]

If it is underpowered like the wii->360 level then the hardware does matter in terms of what games it will get. But I didnt say it was going to flop.

[Bonampak]

If it is underpowered like the wii->360 level then the hardware does matter in terms of what games it will get. But I didnt say it was going to flop.

I don't think that the 3DS is underpowered either way. Its a handheld that has enough juice to run formidable games.

Example: Resident Evil: Revelations is enough proof of what it can do. In some ways, that game looks even BETTER than how Resident Evil 4 looked on the the Wii. This thanks to using a superior game engine that allows for fancy light/shadow effects and whatnot.



It also depends on the dev and what their focus is on. Making a game with great gameplay or making one with nice eye candy.

[WiiUAndMii]

Nintendo hasn't let developers use its full power yet, they keep one of the cores or something locked for now, and they will unlock it later and let devs create better games

[gtt]

Nintendo hasn't let developers use its full power yet, they keep one of the cores or something locked for now, and they will unlock it later and let devs create better games

whole core and 32MB of ram for the OS. with the release of smb3d developers can get a 30% time share of that second core.

also, everything has to go through os calls, which irks some programers I know to no end.

[MrWu]

3DS turned out quite a bit more powerful than initially speculated.

Here's the specs based on official documentaiton leaked by 3Dbrew the wiki for the 3DS homebrew scene

Code: Select all

CPU is a multi-core ARM11 MPcore with 2 cores with VFP extensions  @ 268 MHZ
GPU is PICA @ 268 MHZ with 6 MB of embedded V-RAM separated from FCRAM
DSP *sound chip* @ 134 MHZ
RAM 2X  64MB FCRAM     96 for the game 32 for OS

The CPU bit is most interesting. Whereas IGN and old rumours hinted at 2 run of the mill ARM11 slapped together like the DS's dual chip design, the final design is a proper dual-core ARM11 design.

The other interesting bit with the CPU is each of the 2 cores have VFP extensions.

VFP (Vector Floating Point) technology is an FPU coprocessor extension to the ARM architecture. It provides low-cost single-precision and double-precision floating-point computation fully compliant with the ANSI/IEEE Std 754-1985 Standard for Binary Floating-Point Arithmetic. VFP provides floating-point computation suitable for a wide spectrum of applications such as PDAs, smartphones, voice compression and decompression, three-dimensional graphics and digital audio, printers, set-top boxes, and automotive applications.

I'm not well versed on this, but it aids in the CPU's processing of media and geometry. Recent news of the 'unlocking' of the 2nd ARM core on the 3DS might have something to do with this given I doubt the App core needs the VFP coprocessor when the game is running.

The other interesting bit if the 6MB of embedded VRAM which is from what I gather, a pretty big news from tech heads who know graphics.

Lastly, having a dedicated sound chip means that if we're using the old DS standard, the 3DS have 3 cores. 2 CPU and 1 for the sound. The DS used the oc'd GBA ARM7 to do wireless/sound/ and support for the 2D engine, like displaying maps on the 2nd screen and the like. So essentially, that's one less piece of work off the list of things the ARM 11 will need to do be doing.

And I have to say, listening to the ambient 3DS tunes with headphones on is extremely impressive.

[Bonampak]

3DS turned out quite a bit more powerful than initially speculated.

Here's the specs based on official documentaiton leaked by 3Dbrew the wiki for the 3DS homebrew scene

Code: Select all

CPU is a multi-core ARM11 MPcore with 2 cores with VFP extensions  @ 268 MHZ
GPU is PICA @ 268 MHZ with 6 MB of embedded V-RAM separated from FCRAM
DSP *sound chip* @ 134 MHZ
RAM 2X  64MB FCRAM     96 for the game 32 for OS

The CPU bit is most interesting. Whereas IGN and old rumours hinted at 2 run of the mill ARM11 slapped together like the DS's dual chip design, the final design is a proper dual-core ARM11 design.

The other interesting bit with the CPU is each of the 2 cores have VFP extensions.

VFP (Vector Floating Point) technology is an FPU coprocessor extension to the ARM architecture. It provides low-cost single-precision and double-precision floating-point computation fully compliant with the ANSI/IEEE Std 754-1985 Standard for Binary Floating-Point Arithmetic. VFP provides floating-point computation suitable for a wide spectrum of applications such as PDAs, smartphones, voice compression and decompression, three-dimensional graphics and digital audio, printers, set-top boxes, and automotive applications.

I'm not well versed on this, but it aids in the CPU's processing of media and geometry. Recent news of the 'unlocking' of the 2nd ARM core on the 3DS might have something to do with this given I doubt the App core needs the VFP coprocessor when the game is running.

The other interesting bit if the 6MB of embedded VRAM which is from what I gather, a pretty big news from tech heads who know graphics.

Lastly, having a dedicated sound chip means that if we're using the old DS standard, the 3DS have 3 cores. 2 CPU and 1 for the sound. The DS used the oc'd GBA ARM7 to do wireless/sound/ and support for the 2D engine, like displaying maps on the 2nd screen and the like. So essentially, that's one less piece of work off the list of things the ARM 11 will need to do be doing.

And I have to say, listening to the ambient 3DS tunes with headphones on is extremely impressive.

BOOYAH!

That's all I could add to that.

[Mirr0rR3flection]

BOOYAH!

That's all I could add to that.

LOL so adding that was necessary?

[omega59]

Nintendo hasn't let developers use its full power yet, they keep one of the cores or something locked for now, and they will unlock it later and let devs create better games

Interesting theory... maybe they upgrade graphical drivers and such

[omega59]

3DS turned out quite a bit more powerful than initially speculated.

Here's the specs based on official documentaiton leaked by 3Dbrew the wiki for the 3DS homebrew scene

Code: Select all

CPU is a multi-core ARM11 MPcore with 2 cores with VFP extensions  @ 268 MHZ
GPU is PICA @ 268 MHZ with 6 MB of embedded V-RAM separated from FCRAM
DSP *sound chip* @ 134 MHZ
RAM 2X  64MB FCRAM     96 for the game 32 for OS

The CPU bit is most interesting. Whereas IGN and old rumours hinted at 2 run of the mill ARM11 slapped together like the DS's dual chip design, the final design is a proper dual-core ARM11 design.

The other interesting bit with the CPU is each of the 2 cores have VFP extensions.

VFP (Vector Floating Point) technology is an FPU coprocessor extension to the ARM architecture. It provides low-cost single-precision and double-precision floating-point computation fully compliant with the ANSI/IEEE Std 754-1985 Standard for Binary Floating-Point Arithmetic. VFP provides floating-point computation suitable for a wide spectrum of applications such as PDAs, smartphones, voice compression and decompression, three-dimensional graphics and digital audio, printers, set-top boxes, and automotive applications.

I'm not well versed on this, but it aids in the CPU's processing of media and geometry. Recent news of the 'unlocking' of the 2nd ARM core on the 3DS might have something to do with this given I doubt the App core needs the VFP coprocessor when the game is running.

The other interesting bit if the 6MB of embedded VRAM which is from what I gather, a pretty big news from tech heads who know graphics.

Lastly, having a dedicated sound chip means that if we're using the old DS standard, the 3DS have 3 cores. 2 CPU and 1 for the sound. The DS used the oc'd GBA ARM7 to do wireless/sound/ and support for the 2D engine, like displaying maps on the 2nd screen and the like. So essentially, that's one less piece of work off the list of things the ARM 11 will need to do be doing.

And I have to say, listening to the ambient 3DS tunes with headphones on is extremely impressive.

BOOYAH!

That's all I could add to that.

Ahh the 3ds may have run into an old n64 cartridge problem... lack of storage for higher res graphics. its true the n64 had that problem

[KingBroly]

Not really. Resident Evil Revelations and MGS3 are going to be on 4GB cards, and I believe they said 8GB cards would be available later as well. So that's a lot of space for developers to work with.