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Zelda: Breath of the Wild cut idea involved stabbing your sword into the cliffside to rest/regain stamina

Coming from a GameSpot interview with Zelda art director Satoru Takizawa and director Hidemaro Fujibayashi...

“Until about halfway through the development, we had a spec where you could take your weapon and stab it into a wall. When your stamina gauge was dwindling you could stab the weapon and kind of hang out and rest there.” – Takizawa

“So the answer is that Mr. Miyamoto heard of the concept he said, ‘You can’t stand on the tip of a sword. This is strange.’ And then we explained, ‘No no no, you stab it in.’ Then he’s like, ‘No, it’s not going to work.’ Another idea is that it’s very hard to actually stab a sword into a big piece of rock. We considered that you can stab them into cracks or crevices in the wall, but then you can’t freely use that feature anywhere you want, so I decided not to implement it.”

So starting from the early stages of development we had been constantly showing Mr. Miyamoto our progress. At times we would even show him once a week what we’d been working on, because if we don’t do that, and then go face-to-face and present the idea, tables might be flipped!'” - Fujibayashi

Comments

Top Rated Comment
grcpan
Sun Apr 16 17 09:19am
Rating: 13 (Updated 1 time)

I think climbing is the only reason stamina as a whole has a point in the game tbh.

Now it works as a limitation you need to plan for, which adds a lot of depth in planning a long climb, looking for spots to stop in between to recover stamina or maybe just checking if you have some stamina pots in your inventory to work your way up a mountain.

Sometimes you realise mid climb that you won't make it and you either have to find a solution around you quickly or restart your climb. It feels more like a puzzle than a chore.

If you could have such a simple workaround for it there would not be much point in having stamina in the first place.

link2dpast
Sun Apr 16 17 08:07am
Rating: 1 (Updated 2 times)

Why is it whenever I hear anyone talking about Mr Miyamoto it's always a pain to work with him.

Anyway its a cool concept in theory but it would have eliminated the need to upgrade your stamina and use elixirs to restore it mid-climb. Maybe they can find a more functional way to implement this in the next game.

grcpan
Sun Apr 16 17 08:12am
(Updated 1 time)

Interesting to see that Miyamoto did not like a gamey feature. Always thought he did not care about realism.

It is also interesting that even though Miyamoto did not like it, they still went with it until they themselves realised it is not going to work.

I don't think he cares about realism but about what feels natural for the player. For example, in Mario, it feels natural to use your fireball power underwater, even if it isn't very realistic. I also remember this thing in Iwata Asks where Miyamoto suggested a vampire's sucking action (no innuendo intended) to happen on the depress of a button instead of the press.
And I think that's what he means here in BotW about standing on top of a sword. With the physics engine the way it is, it would feel really strange Link can suddenly defy physics by standing on his sword that he stuck inside a cliff

Yea I guess it did not fit with the principles they built the game on.

mogster
Sun Apr 16 17 08:19am
Rating: 1

So this got cut for being 'unrealistic' yet being able to eat while climbing/swimming stays? This would have been a useful feature. Perhaps it could have been limited to certain weapons. Why is it every time I hear about Miyamoto flipping tables, the game in question is worse off for it?

grcpan
Sun Apr 16 17 08:32am
(Updated 2 times)

I don't see how adding more value to food and upgrading stamina makes the game worse. If anything this would remove a lot of depth from the game.

It also makes climbing more interesting since you have to find the best path to climb mountains instead of going in a straight line.

It doesn't sound like they did not implement it because Miyamoto did not like it though.

Considering how amazing the game is, I think the table flipping worked.

Please explain how being able to recover stamina while climbing would have detracted value from anything else. Doing so could have reduced sword durability, thus making a risk/reward and not affecting any other parts of the game or the various other values.

I'm not even a game developer and I came up with that idea in twenty second. I'm sorry this just reeks of Miyamoto throwing his toys out of the pram and taking away a feature that would have made the game more enjoyable. The feature would have worked, but Miyamoto didn't want it to work for whatever reason.

grcpan
Sun Apr 16 17 08:59am
Rating: 1 (Updated 1 time)

And then people would complain about weapons breaking even easier, while still depth is removed from the game. Also as Fujibayashi said they themselves did not think the feature would work in the end and dropped it, not because Miyamoto said so. I still don't see how this would make the game more enjoyable though.

See my reply to GRCPan

Any one of us can eat while climbing or swimming but no one here can shove a sword into a rock and stand on it. So it's beyond me how you can put them in the same category to begin with.

Once again, Miyamoto's input has made the game worse. I just really wish that he would stop giving his input and just allow creators to do things without him. He often seems out of touch with modern game creation and just needs to retire and let some new blood take over.

nurio
Sun Apr 16 17 10:01am
Rating: 2

The game is worse because you can't stand on your sword? Being able to stand on your sword not only would look odd, it also wouldn't add anything to the game, because regaining stamina mid-climb is already really easy

kuro
Sun Apr 16 17 09:12am
Rating: 1

Some people here acting like this decision is equal to the no story decision in Paper Mario. The devs themselves reached the same conclusion that Miyamoto did: that it was not necessary/unrealistic. This feature would have been handy sure, but some people here act like the remove made the game unplayable. If they did ended up including it, a lot of things like the always raining areas would not make sense at all.

grcpan
Sun Apr 16 17 09:19am
Rating: 13 (Updated 1 time)

I think climbing is the only reason stamina as a whole has a point in the game tbh.

Now it works as a limitation you need to plan for, which adds a lot of depth in planning a long climb, looking for spots to stop in between to recover stamina or maybe just checking if you have some stamina pots in your inventory to work your way up a mountain.

Sometimes you realise mid climb that you won't make it and you either have to find a solution around you quickly or restart your climb. It feels more like a puzzle than a chore.

If you could have such a simple workaround for it there would not be much point in having stamina in the first place.

Well, it could work if there were cracks here and there, but that must have been designwd from the get-go. Or maybe have them randomized in a way. But if you could just "stab" any mountainside to rest it would ruin much of thegame, as you mentioned.

Given how often it rains in this game, and how much of a pain that is for heavy climbers like me, this feature would have been MUCH appreciated.

And I don't see how it's at all unrealistic. As if other parts of the game aren't.

Dumb move.

You can already work around rain. Just start a fire and wait it out.

If you can find a spot where the rain won't put it out.

And that requires supplies, much like this would have.

It's an option. Not necessarily an end-all be-all answer to climbing.

grcpan
Sun Apr 16 17 09:45am
Rating: 1 (Updated 1 time)

I think it is easy to find spots to start a fire in most places. Using supplies and working with your surroundings is the whole point of the game though, I don't see that as a problem.

The only way I see this feature working would be if you lost the sword completely when using it this way, not just some durability. Otherwise it would always be the best option.

Adding that would have taking any risk away from climbing so no it's not dumb. Those features are supposed to be an inconvenience when climbing. makes no sense that hanging from a sword one handed would refill stamina. it should have the opposite effect. How does hanging from a sword one handed heal stamina but not just hanging from a mountain mid climb?

makes no sense that hanging from a sword one handed would refill stamina. it should have the opposite effect.
They were talking about standing on top of the sword, not hanging from it, though

funshaundi
Sun Apr 16 17 09:28am
Rating: 4

Miyamoto strikes again. Retire, please.

nurio
Sun Apr 16 17 10:07am
Rating: 4

Yeah, Breath of the Wild turned out terrible because of Miyamoto

(That was sarcasm, just in case it wasn't clear)

entity
Sun Apr 16 17 10:12am
Rating: 1

Waaah, I did NOT see the sarcasm in your comment.

arod79
Sun Apr 16 17 06:50pm
Rating: 1

You ( and the 3 people that liked it) should be embarrassed for yourself, but you're not, so come back and read this in 5-10 years to see if you've grown.

I was one of those 3 people that liked it. Not because I agree with his statements (though Star Fox Zero, Wii Music, and Paper Mario Sticker Star/Color Splash could be good arguments in his favor) but just because it made me laugh.

The good comes with the bad, I suppose. I see, well you're only encouraging him. lol ;0)

mereel
Sun Apr 16 17 10:24am
Rating: 2

Good call, Miyamoto. That maneuver would have cheapened the natural progression enabled by the lack of stamina earlier in the game. Very good call by Shiggy.

I agree with Miyamoto and the developers on this one. Part of the charm of climbing is the resource management/puzzle aspect of planning around your stamina wheel.

What they ended up with was enjoyable and making it needlessly easier would have been a detriment to the experience, in my opinion.

thorn-rock
Sun Apr 16 17 01:25pm
Rating: 1 (Updated 3 times)

Thanks Miyamoto for getting rid of a bad idea. Again.

Edit :
Seriously guys, how can you not see how bad that idea was ?
It would have needed some serious limitations for it to work.
To the point where they might as well get rid of it because it would have looked pretty dumb anyway.
As GRCPAN said, losing the sword entirely because you have to leave it there could have made it okay I guess and to be honest that's probably what the devs had in mind. How would you get the sword back anyway ? I still don't think it would have worked that well though. Climbing is well balanced as it is. If you implement this but as a consequence have to make every cliff bigger to retain the balance, I fail to see the point.

They could have limited it to some cracks in the walls to make more interesting and visually more realistic, like simply to make it work visually. But then tell what would the difference be between this and the spots where you can rest that already exist in the game. None, there would be no difference. It doesn't make sense and it has no point.

sw4j
Sun Apr 16 17 01:55pm
Rating: 1

The more I see posts of people who have a hatred for Miyamoto, the more I'm convinced they're hating on him because they saw other people do it online and thought it was the "in" thing to do. None of their arguments make the slightest bit of sense. He was 100% right, and the devs came to the same conclusion on their own, which means that any "bad" decision attributed to Miyamoto is misattributed, as devs clearly have the option of coming to their own conclusions.

crow
Sun Apr 16 17 04:10pm
Rating: 2

Thats a good way to break a sword. Maybe would have been interesting If you could simply get a type of "weapon" used for climbing, like a pick.

That would also make you wonder who would be carrying picks, and from there the answer is "Climbing enemies"
Its a shame it was never thought of in that regard. Climbing enemies would have been a neat challenge and getting a tool like that from them would be yet another way to prepare for those long climbs up steep mountains.

Okay, now this is something I could definitely get behind. And I can totally see Lizalfos be the type to climb with a tool. (I actually can even see them climb without a tool, but that kinda goes against the idea.)

I don't always agree with him, but I definitely agree with Miyamoto here. Not only would it look odd, it just defeats the challenge of scaling a mountain. At least with stamina regeneration it's something you have to prepare in advanced and adds a layer of strategy. Where sticking a sword in the mountain seems like the easy/lazy way out.

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