A portion of a GameSpot interview with Nintendo's Takashi Tezuka...
GS: Traditionally, Mario sequels have been very different from one another, but the New Super Mario Bros. series games tend to be very similar mechanically and visually. Is that a design decision?
TT: It's intentional. That similarity in the visual style and the control style is all intentional. The things we feel like we've already promised the gamer is that Peach will be kidnapped by Bowser, and Mario will move from left to right. We know that's what people are expecting! [Laughs] We know that there are all types of Mario games, as you said. So for us, with the New Super Mario Bros. series, we don't really need to mess with it. This is what people want.
One of the things we always focus on in development is that we want a wide audience to play these games and enjoy them. So we're looking at games that are accessible and intuitive. So, for example, we have a recurring enemy type from one game to the next. If in the first game the enemy acts a certain way and has a certain functionality, our audience says, "OK, I know what to expect." If they see that character in [the new] game and it's completely different, I don't think that's a good thing. For characters like the Goombas and the Koopas, those are the building blocks, the fundamental things that we're not going to change.
GS: There has been a lot of push from certain analysts about iPhone games from Nintendo. How do you feel about the idea of Mario being on iPhone? Pushing past that, is it possible to make a Mario game that would be touch screen only? There was Mario vs. Donkey Kong 2: March of the Minis on the DS, which was a puzzle game that was primarily, if not exclusively, touch screen. Do you think it would be possible in any other genre?
TT: We can definitely make a Mario game that's touch screen only. It wouldn't be a 2D side-scrolling Mario platformer, but I think we can definitely make games maybe in the vein of Mario vs. Donkey Kong or something like that. I think that's definitely possible. Would we make that for another platform? No. Of course not. It would be on a Nintendo platform. But it's definitely something we could do. It just wouldn't be a 2D side-scrolling platformer.
Full interview here
GS: Traditionally, Mario sequels have been very different from one another, but the New Super Mario Bros. series games tend to be very similar mechanically and visually. Is that a design decision?
TT: It's intentional. That similarity in the visual style and the control style is all intentional. The things we feel like we've already promised the gamer is that Peach will be kidnapped by Bowser, and Mario will move from left to right. We know that's what people are expecting! [Laughs] We know that there are all types of Mario games, as you said. So for us, with the New Super Mario Bros. series, we don't really need to mess with it. This is what people want.
One of the things we always focus on in development is that we want a wide audience to play these games and enjoy them. So we're looking at games that are accessible and intuitive. So, for example, we have a recurring enemy type from one game to the next. If in the first game the enemy acts a certain way and has a certain functionality, our audience says, "OK, I know what to expect." If they see that character in [the new] game and it's completely different, I don't think that's a good thing. For characters like the Goombas and the Koopas, those are the building blocks, the fundamental things that we're not going to change.
GS: There has been a lot of push from certain analysts about iPhone games from Nintendo. How do you feel about the idea of Mario being on iPhone? Pushing past that, is it possible to make a Mario game that would be touch screen only? There was Mario vs. Donkey Kong 2: March of the Minis on the DS, which was a puzzle game that was primarily, if not exclusively, touch screen. Do you think it would be possible in any other genre?
TT: We can definitely make a Mario game that's touch screen only. It wouldn't be a 2D side-scrolling Mario platformer, but I think we can definitely make games maybe in the vein of Mario vs. Donkey Kong or something like that. I think that's definitely possible. Would we make that for another platform? No. Of course not. It would be on a Nintendo platform. But it's definitely something we could do. It just wouldn't be a 2D side-scrolling platformer.
RSS Feeds:
I just want a new Super Mario Bros 2 / Super Mario USA type game..
"We know that there are all types of Mario games, as you said. So for us, with the New Super Mario Bros. series, we don't really need to mess with it."
shovel, I don't like the sound of that at all... Settle with all those other Mario variations cus 2D Mario ain't going back.
Terrible attitude as usual Nintendo.
Do you guys live under a rock, because these are the things people are complaining about more than anything.
@LegendofSantiago
So just because other companies do it, it's okay for Nintendo to do it. Or wait, it's okay for Nintendo to do it, but everyone else can't. When it comes to remakes and rehashes, I'd prefer no one to contribute. I hate the fact Capcom likes to put out the fighting series twenty times before they're finished and people still buy them. And I refuse to buy Ocarins of Time 3D. I even felt Galaxy 2 was a waste at full price because of it being a lazy clone of the previous game. It was still a fun game, but it pained me to finish halfway through. As with NSMB. They may be 'fun' at first, but they add no depth, replayability, nothing new or fancy. Frack the graphics, I want to be challenged.
Defending the thought "3D marios introduce new mechanics while 2D refreshes" is complete bull. Both should have something equally revolutionary to bring to the table to keep it "fresh". Eventually, my little nieces and nephew will get tired of the same ole boring Mario game on the 3DS and Wii.
I don't know what I was replying too and my thought is probably all over the place, but I guess that's it.
@FireFoxMcCloud with all the games and ips under Nintendo's belt they could be a lot worse. I completely disagree with your thoughts on galaxy 2 and oot 3d. Galaxy 2 was made by a dev team that wanted to do more with the game and they added plenty of stuff and it had a ton of content. I felt it wad worth the purchase. I'm sorry you couldn't enjoy it as well. As for oot 3d it was the first remake of what is consideredby most to be the greatest game of all time. This remake had newer and more modern visuals with better animation and it made it feel newer with its enhanced control scheme. And this might seem like the biggest offender to you guys for some reason, but if you don't like it, don't buy it.
I'm glad Nintendo actually realizes they shouldn't make Mario's Epic Yarn like half of you apparently want. Return to Dreamland was better than Epic Yarn anyway.
People who can't tell the difference in quality between the DS game and the Wii game aren't qualified to complain about these games. If the Wii game felt like the DS game, I'd be right there with you saying they're awful, but Nintendo remembered how to make a Mario game after the DS effort, and I expect more improvements for NSMBU, even if they aren't reflected in the art style/music.
The 2D Mario Wii team is talented, even if people can't realize it. There are few reasons why few make 2D platformers any more; one is because everyone but Nintendo is awful at 2D platformer level design (except Ubisoft with Rayman). Mario is almost the only "obstacle course" type 2D platformer left - Rayman is essentially a collectathon, Kirby is about being overpowered (which is great), etc. I guess DK counts, and I'm sure there will be another soon (within 2-3 years).
Nintedo will be forced to take the series in a slightly different direction after NSMBU anyway. NSMB is like SMB, NSMBW is like SMB3, and NSMBU will be like SMW, and there's no more games that Tezuka has familiarity with, except maybe Yoshi's Island.
The reason for your opinion is that you played the DS game. That game was awful in comparison to NSMBW. It's possibly the worst Mario ever, behind Sunshine, SMB2J, and SMB2US. Play the Wii game if you want a view of the series' potential for growth, since it's actually great.
Sorry if I sounded harsh, I'm just tired of people complaining about good games and series fatigue in a series that hadn't had a new entry since 1992 before NSMB DS in 2006, and currently has two entries.
@Lyude77
I've never played the DS version, but I've played the Wii version. I fail to see any "potential growth" from a game that already felt stale when it came out.
As long as the NSMB games are different enough like NSMBU and 2 are, I will keep buying them, since they are very fun and great. However, I really do want them to make it much more differant than what they've done. ._.
They should make a New Super Mario World, and then a New Yoshi's Island, and then a New Mario 2. I'd so love that to happen, but it most likely won't.
3D Mario has seen lots of innovation, 2D Mario on the other hand has seen very little since it was brought back with NSMB - that said, NSMB U looks like an awesome lil game [something I can't honestly say about the others in this series].
And 2D Mario, well, Mario in general will probably never change that much - Mario, like Apple, gets off scot-free for alot of things [no less the now dreaded 'Collectathon' trope is never laid at it's door]. That's just the way it is.
2D Mario does far outsell 3D Mario innovations, so yeah... :/
Actually it's not quite what people want. Well, it's certainly not quite what I want.
I think he's taking what we said we want and distorting it ever so slightly so it's not exactly what we want.
I don't what a girly looking Mario platformer, for example.
When did I ever say I did?
Yet, each new New Super Mario Bros games looks more and more girly, cute and twee than the last.
I also never said I don't want the games to visually evolve, just that I want them to retain their 2D viewpoint and 2D gameplay. You can still make them look lovely with lots of depth and 3D in the world etc, but just lock the camera and gameplay in 2D for the most part.
I mean look at how much more visually impressive and striking Return to Dreamland is compared to these New Super Mario Bros games and yet that games still perfectly retains the classic 2D viewpoint and 2D gameplay mechanics.
That's the kind of thing I want to retain with the new Mario platformers and that's also the kind of thing I want to evolve.
I agree about not trying to shoehorn a traditional 2D side scrolling Mario platformer onto a touchscreen however.
Tezuka - "Yeah, we never do any changes for nsmb because we like to be cheap and get massive profits, and casuals buy the shovel out of it anyway [laughs]"
Having played through Rayman completely, yeah, it's a collectathon, but in what way isn't it an 'obstacle course' type 2D platformer? Because I can't think of one. In fact I find the main reason I liked Origins so much is because it pulled off being both fairly well. (and I'm a bit of an OCD completitionist, so I like collectathons in most all their forms anyway... especially the Mario ones)
To all the people who keep whining, complaining etc. ad nauseum about the NSMB series being stale, bland and whatever else you want to say and that everybody is tired of it blah blah blah, might I remind you that there are literally millions upon millions who would disagree with you and the sales back that up, and if you think they are all "the casuals" you would be quite mistaken. I'm a perfect example.
New Super Mario Bros. Wii (and the older 2D Super Marios) are the only video games my wife plays with me. I enjoy them for that reason alone and will continue to purchase new iterations. It helps that they are solid titles in their own right for my own play sessions as well.
I can of miss that way the games looked so different from one another (with the exception of SMB and Lost levels). I'm happy for Mario to have his own look now, makes him feel more like a rounded character, but it doesn't mean he has to be limited to this look for every game.
Why not revisit cartoon Mario? They could actually properly replicate some of his old looks with today's graphics and have you play as him in all his sprite forms!
But CoD sell millions upon millions every time a new one is released, yet they get called stale, bland generic and whatever else you want to say and that everybody is tired of it blah blah blah and there are literally millions upon millions who would disagree with you and the sales back that up too.
I know I was going somewhere with this...
More or less sounds like "We don't want to offend people that only played Super Mario Bros. 1, so we decided to be as stale and formulaic as possible so that they will keep buying the games".
The nostalgia jazz (SMB3 and SMW references or elements) to entice people that actually played games past SMB1, but it seems like the main reason they are the same is to target the casuals who know nothing except Super Mario Bros. 1 on NES. Those people buy it on similarity alone. The Mario fans buy it because it's Mario and the nostalgia fans buy it for the Koopa Kids, WORLD 1-1 in every game and act like it's charming and new every time, and anything involving capes, tanookis or raccoons.
But that's a horrible way to look at it. "Oh, if we have Goombas doing twirls and wearing a spike helmet as the first enemy, everyone's gonna flip tables and hate the game, so we gotta make sure you always relive 1-1 so you're like OH I REMEMBER THIS. I KNOW THIS WELL"
At the very least, why not have a hard mode. Or you know, make (or have some other team make) a sidescrolling Mario title for people who want something more than "lol doing the same thing but with reskinned powerups! AND MAYBE 3 MORE PEOPLE"?
I just find it so funny that Mario has to always do the same thing. It's like Mickey Mouse prior to Epic Mickey. OH YOU CAN'T CHANGE ANYTHING ABOUT HIM. GOTTA BE THE SAME.
Link's not always saving Zelda from Ganon. Kirby's not always fighting Dedede. Samus isn't always fighting Mother Brain or on Zebes. Pokemon isn't always in Kanto with the same 150.
The point of NSMB1 was to recapture the SMB1 fans, but I don't see why ALL of them have to do that. Sad times.
@MrChewtoy
Considering the fact that Mario looks different in Mario & Luigi, Paper Mario, SSB and in the artworks for some games (like Mario Hoops or Strikers, etc) it sucks that they clearly have a wide range of styles that people are familiar with and don't use them.
And I honestly preferred the SNES art style, or the GBA remake styles and stuff.
And this comes from someone who skipped the SNES in favor of Genesis, so it's not nostalgia talking.
@Lyude77
>mfw you say SMB2 USA and Sunshine are in the worst Marios.
Sunshine was easily one of my favorite Mario and Gamecube titles of all time.
And while SMB2 USA isn't really a SMB game, I don't know how you could place that as bottom tier.
@Blue_Falcon
NOPE.
My problem with the style is that they look the same and that inadvertently makes me feel like they are the same no matter what. It also doesn't help that they all retain the same terrible wah-wah music. It's just not good music, at all.
But the biggest problem with the series is that it claims to be "New" Super Mario Bros., when it is in fact just "Sidescroller featuring Mario and enticing you by pulling your nostalgia strings".
OH MY GOD. KOOPA KIDS? RACCOON TAIL? SMW MAP? I'M SO SOLD!
The games aren't challenging. I have barely even played some of the early Mario titles (got Genesis instead of SNES and I never owned/played SMB3 until much later) and I plowed through NSMBW getting all the shiny gold stars/hidden coins and never seeing GAME OVER or the Super Guide option. I'm not good at classic Mario. That shouldn't have happened.
However I loved EVERY MINUTE of Donkey Kong Country Returns and I died tons of times and saw the pig trying to get me to use Super Guide on my road to get 100% (I haven't even done the Mirror Mode yet). And I skipped the Donkey Kong Country SNES games completely because I am not a fan of DK himself (or wasn't originally) or his extended family. Played the demo at Comic-Con and fell in love with the game. The music was good and the style was nice.
DKCR did everything right, in my opinion and I am sad that NSMB doesn't.
Art and music are only a piece of the problem and the most obvious you can point out since we haven't played NSMB2 or NSMBU. Maybe we're wrong and they switched up NSMB2 and NSMBU, and they'll actually be better games, but at the end it will still look and sound lazy. Which is just disheartening, like how Kirby is getting a better anniversary disc than Mario did.
@FrenchFryGuy
Ignoring casuals, since they buy anything, do you just buy every Mario game no matter what it is? A Fanboy would buy a Mario title regardless of what it was.
I love Zelda games being different. I like Toon Link, but I don't like ONLY using Toon Link or if they only used the same adult Link for example. Zelda always tries switching it up while keeping the same gameplay. Why can't Mario do that? LIKE HE USED TO.
And with your logic, like NeroSuferoth said, I guess Call of Duty is full of originality since literally millions upon millions continue to buy them. Or are they all "casuals", but the NSMB buyers aren't? You can't play that game.
Play the DS version if you want to see, honestly. It's WAY worse. It's like baby's first platformer, the same world themes, single exits, new power-ups that are never used, requiring power-ups to be carried in from other levels to get star coins/exit access, along with two "secret" worlds that you have to be Mini-Mario to access. It's like they didn't want people to play the full game because they felt ashamed. They fixed the last three issues with NSMBW and added multi-player, but kept "baby's first platformer" (arguably, but I'm good at Mario), (mostly) single exits, and recycled world themes. NSMBU looks to be fixing the single exit/boring world map problem and the constantly recycled world themes problem and avoids the badness of NSMBDS, and that's enough progress for me (but probably not for some others).
NSMB2 looks to be focusing on a gimmick that increases speed of play, so I'll have to wait and see how that one turns out. I have less faith in the portable team.It is an obstacle course too, you're right. I just feel like it's more of a collectathon. In any case, it's different from Mario. XD
I mean, I didn't have much to choose from, and I wanted to say more than one, haha. NSMBDS is obviously worst, SMB2J is second worst, to me, but other than that they're all great. I personally loved SMB2USA, but not as much as SMB, SMB3, SMW, SM64, or Galaxy 1/2. Same with Sunshine, though I probably liked SMB2USA more because it's 2D. I didn't put them in order, for whatever reason. Sorry.
Also, I'd be up for a hard mode. 1HKO Mario regardless of powerups would be hard, even in the modern games.
@MoldyClay
@NeroSuferoth
I find it funny how some of you guys find it so important to make people see it your way as if it's the definitive answer on the matter.
That being said.
@MoldyClay
I buy 2D Mario because I still like 2D Mario games and the graphics have never been the selling points to me. It's always been about the gameplay, and to me, NSMB still delivers on that front. I try to spend less time b!tching and more time going with the flow and not obsessing over things that are just subjective from person to person. More people should try it.
@NeroSuferoth
Those games don't appeal to me and I don't make it my business to worry about what goes on with CoD etc. I only concern myself with what i'm interested in. Having said that, the comparison is weak.
Come the end of 2012 there will have been 9 COD games released since it's inception in 2003. There has been a COD game released every year except for 2004.
Since NSMB's inception in 2006 by 2012 there will have been 4. NSMB in 2006. Three years later with NSMB Wii in 2009. And now three more years later we will get a 3DS sequel and a Wii U sequel. I don't call that COD level overkill. But whatever.
YUP!
And therein lies the difference between you (and, for that matter, almost everyone else) and I. See, I enjoy video games and my appreciation from them stems from their mechanical design, i.e. gameplay, the thing that seperates them from every other medium of entertainment.
Let me guess, you think SotC, and Okami, and Rez, and all that indiez crap like Limbo and Braid are the epitomes of video game 'innovation'? You probably think hideously boring dreck like Epic Yarn is like one of the best platfomers evarrr, right? Because these games have style and imagination! Because that's what video games are all about, style and pretty colours and imaginationnnn, not mechanics and structural design!
With the exception of The Lost Levels, which ones are? I mean, my view on this is kinda skewed since I play games that are orders of magnitudes harder than the most difficult games on the NES, so to me even DKCR and Galaxy 2 were not even remotely challenging. I guess a couple of levels in SMB3 World-8 require a pretty high degree of precision, but otherwise, nope, can't think of anything!
Personal anecdotes don't tell me anything. If anything, it shows your abilities (or lack thereof) as a gamer.
In any case, NSMBWii is the best 2D Mario to date as far as level design (the core of the game) is concerned, and this is beyond opinion (meaning it is an inarguable truth). You can disagree and make some illogical connection between level quality and aesthetics/music (lol), but that only proves that you simply don't like video games, period!
Funny, because I wasn't trying to be funny... But it is funny that you were the one who jumped in championing the NSMB series as the end all be all of 2D Marios and throwing numbers at people, but totally disregard the same points about another game series based in that simply you don't like it.
Also, you accuse me of doing the same thing you do since you have defended NSMBU on almost each post too, so how is that any different?
About the comparison being weak, I don't see how so, If anything a series that, as you point out, has been seeing releases in a yearly basis should show some noticeable drop in sales by now, yet CoD keeps selling at a higher to equal rate still.
But anyways, I don't mean to make this into an ill willed argument, I'm just saying that NSMB is not exempt of judgement based on your points.
@NeroSuferoth
I almost don't even feel like starting because there are just so many inaccuracies in what you just said. You're making a lot of false accusations that just aren't true. I mean where did I accuse you of anything? And I never said you were trying to be funny, I said I find it funny, and I do. It's like it's so important for you to convince people that NSMB is just the worst offense to gaming ever and i'm simply saying, that's not true, and why do you care? If you don't like the series why b!tch about it to the point of sounding like a broken record?
Anyway,
For starters, I never said NSMB was the be all in all of Mario games. Show me where I said that ever. Oh that's right you can't because I didn't. Thank you very much. So there's one false accusation.
Secondly, I'm not telling people how to feel about NSMB, i'm just simply defending the rite, mine included, of the people who are ok with the series as it is to feel that way against the handful of usuals on here who find it trendy to nonstop rag on the series. If you find the need to get all defensive about that, well then that is your problem, not mine. So that makes two false accusations.
Thirdly, You brought up CoD not me, but the reason I said your comparison with CoD is weak is because you're saying the NSMB series is stale and suffers from the same old same old and yet there haven't been nearly as many NSMB releases as there have been CoD so I don't see NSMB at the level of overkill like people see with CoD and subsequently use to disparage the NSMB series with.
Finally, I just said I don't care what people who play CoD say or do or anything regarding the series because it doesn't appeal to me. If you think for some reason that I should, well sorry but I don't. I don't have the time to worry about things that I don't have any interest in to begin with. If you do great.
I'm a do what you want play what you want kind of guy. If you don't like the NSMB series anymore or never did or whatever, what difference does it make to you one way or the other? That's my point. It doesn't make any difference to me what happens or how many CoD releases there are yet to come etc. because I don't care about the franchise so therefore, I also tend to not comment on articles that relate to it. Maybe you should try that as it relates to NSMB unless of course you just like stirring the sh!t. Hmmmm.
Try not being so damn angry and pessimistic all the time NeroSuferoth. Seriously.
There seems to be some miscommunication here...
"I mean where did I accuse you of anything?"
It seemed to me as if you were accusing me of trying to sway people into my view of NSMBU because of this: "I find it funny how some of you guys find it so important to make people see it your way as if it's the definitive answer on the matter"... My mistake then if not.
"And I never said you were trying to be funny"
I never said you did, I only said I wasn't trying to.
"It's like it's so important for you to convince people that NSMB is just the worst offense to gaming ever"
Again, this seems like you're implying that that's what my purpose is... I say it again, it is not.
"and why do you care?"
I care about as much as any fan of Mario would, that is why I voice my concern when I don't like or agree with any given point of a specific game comes to my attention.
"I never said NSMB was the be all in all of Mario games. Show me where I said that ever."
That is correct, you never did, you said this: "To all the people who keep whining, complaining etc. ad nauseum about the NSMB series being stale, bland and whatever else you want to say and that everybody is tired of it blah blah blah, might I remind you that there are literally millions upon millions who would disagree with you and the sales back that up, and if you think they are all "the casuals" you would be quite mistaken. I'm a perfect example."... To which I gave a hyperbole of said comment which brought us here, sorry for that.
"I'm not telling people how to feel about NSMB, i'm just simply defending the rite, mine included, of the people who are ok with the series
That is what I said when I said that there's no difference between you defending along with the people who like it and me complaning along the people who have issues with it... It is our right.
"against the handful of usuals on here who find it trendy to nonstop rag on the series. If you find the need to get all defensive about that, well then that is your problem, not mine."
I don't care if some think it's trendy, my complaints are genuine... Also, I'm not getting defensive, just posting my counter comments.
"You brought up CoD not me"
I didn't say you did, I did to make a point.
"you're saying the NSMB series is stale and suffers from the same old same old and yet there haven't been nearly as many NSMB releases as there has been CoD so I don't see NSMB at the level of overkill like people see with CoD."
You're right, is not on the same level, however they still feel and look the same to me... Hopefully they don't get to reach the same level of CoD for the sake of just not reaching that number of entries.
"just said I don't care what people who play CoD say or do or anything regarding the series because it doesn't appeal to me."
And what I meant was that regardless, CoD sells just like NSMB sells and that sales numbers aren't an exact meassuring tool in some cases.
"If you think for some reason that I should, well sorry but I don't and i'm therefore not going to be comparing a series that I do like to one that I don't."
No, if you don't like the series that is fine because just like you say about NSMB they sell to millions of other people.
"I'm a do what you want play what you want kind of guy. If you don't like the NSMB series anymore or never did or whatever, what difference does it make to you one way or the other? That's my point. It doesn't make any difference to me what happens or how many CoD releases there are yet to come etc. because I don't care about the franchise so therefore, I also tend to not comment on articles that relate to it. Maybe you should try that as it relates to NSMB unless of course you just like stirring the sh!t. Hmmmm."
All of this kind of brings me back to what I said before... I comment because I care and all that, you know how this videogame sites/forums business goes.
"Try not being so damn angry and pessimistic all the time NeroSuferoth. Seriously."
If you notice closely, not that I'm saying you should waste time on me and my posts honestly, I'm not negative about everything, just some specific things. It is not my intention to bother anyone in particular just sharing my thoughts.
Yeah, I hadn't even thought of those games. I love that Mario has a definite look now, but it wouldn't hurt Nintendo to make a main 3D/2D game where he's altered somehow.
Huh... I guess so, but I don't see why he would. I could be wrong, but the statement doesn't really lead anywhere that way.
View the full discussion!